House Homeland Security Committee Holds Hearing About DHS Using Drones

2 days ago

On Tuesday, the House Homeland Security Committee held hearing entitled, “Exploring the Use of Unmanned Aircraft Systems Across the DHS Enterprise.”

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Transcript

00:00:00Good afternoon. The Committee on Homeland Security, Committee on Border Security and

00:00:04Enforcement, and Subcommittee on Emergency Management and Technology will now come to order.

00:00:11Without objection, the chair is authorized to declare the committee in recess at any point.

00:00:17The purpose of this hearing is to examine the Department of Homeland Security's use of unmanned

00:00:22aircraft systems across DHS's components to enhance situational awareness and increase

00:00:29capabilities across its mission. I now recognize myself for an opening statement.

00:00:36Today, we convene to examine the expanding role of unmanned aircraft systems across the

00:00:42Department of Homeland Security. UAS technology, more commonly simply referred to as drones,

00:00:49play a critical role in border security, drug interdiction, disaster mitigation,

00:00:55and emergency response. As the United States faces evolving security threats,

00:01:02drones have become an important tool and serve as a force multiplier for both law enforcement

00:01:09and first responders. Drones can provide federal law enforcement with faster response times

00:01:16and a tactical advantage to include surveillance, remote tracking, aid delivery,

00:01:23and intelligence collection. Since 2005, the Department of Homeland Security has integrated

00:01:29unmanned aircraft systems into its border security mission. Drones have equipped Customs and Border

00:01:36Protection with the ability to locate and track threats in the air, while also increasing officer

00:01:42and agent safety on the ground. CBP operates several UAS programs, including a small UAS

00:01:50program enabling rapid deployment of quadrocopters to provide United States Border Patrol agents

00:01:58with real-time situational awareness. Thanks to the integration of this drone technology,

00:02:05CBC seized approximately 2,800 pounds of illicit narcotics from FY 2020 through FY 2023.

00:02:16CBP's air and marine operations oversee the agency's large unmanned aircraft fleet.

00:02:23The MQ-9s, a critical asset in border security and surveillance operation,

00:02:29has extended the eyes of agents in the land and maritime environments. Equipped with cutting-edge

00:02:36radar systems, these platforms operate covertly, significantly enhancing situational awareness,

00:02:44threat detection, and interdiction capabilities to strengthen our national security.

00:02:51In addition to border security, drones are also deployed in response to natural disasters

00:02:57and national emergencies. In Mississippi, we have seen how these systems have proven invaluable to

00:03:04law enforcement and first responders, assisting in search and rescue missions in the aftermath

00:03:10of hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, fires, and other disasters. In this ever-evolving field,

00:03:18partnering with private industry and public institutions are critical to enhance law

00:03:24enforcement's capabilities. DHS partnerships, like the one with Mississippi State University's

00:03:32Rasput Flight Research Laboratory, have contributed to multiple advances in UAS

00:03:38applications. Drones have undeniably strengthened DHS operations by increasing efficiency,

00:03:46reducing manpower requirements, and saving American lives. As technology continues to evolve,

00:03:54it is imperative that DHS further develop and define these capabilities.

00:04:01I believe that Congress has a responsibility to ensure that DHS, along with its public and

00:04:07private partners, has the necessary resources to advance the critical technology in support of

00:04:14national security and public safety. I hope this hearing provides us with some concrete ideas on

00:04:22which this body can act in furthering this important mission on behalf of our fellow citizens.

00:04:28Before I yield to the Ranking Member, I would like to take a moment to thank

00:04:32Supervisory Special Agent Larry Martino for his outstanding contributions to the committee.

00:04:39Over the past 18 months, Agent Martino has been detailed to the Border Security and Enforcement

00:04:45Subcommittee, where he has provided invaluable expertise and guidance on critical border

00:04:51security matters. His deep knowledge, dedication, and commitment to strengthening our national

00:04:58security has been instrumental in shaping key policy discussions and legislative initiatives.

00:05:05Next week, Agent Martino will return to his home agency, HSI, where he will continue to

00:05:12play a vital role in combating transnational crime, enforcing immigration law, and protecting

00:05:19our national security. I extend the committee's sincere gratitude for his service in safeguarding

00:05:26our great nation. At this time, I would like to recognize the Ranking Member for the Subcommittee

00:05:33on Border Security and Enforcement, the gentleman from the great state of California, Mr. Correa,

00:05:38for his opening statement. Thank you, Chairman Guest and Chairman Strong, for holding this most

00:05:44important hearing today. I want to thank our guests today as well. Thank you very much.

00:05:50Important hearing today on the use of unmanned aircraft systems across DHS. Today, we're going

00:05:57to hear about how drones are used by the Department of Homeland Security to strengthen disaster

00:06:02response, border security, and keep Americans safe. It's important to hear from our partners

00:06:09under field, where the rubber meets the road, as well as those developing these critical

00:06:14technologies about what we in Congress can do to support federal, state, and local partners

00:06:21in this effort. And I believe we also need to continue to support research in new and emerging

00:06:28technologies like drones. With the terrible environmental disasters happening almost on a

00:06:35daily basis across the country, we must support our frontline partners with the tools that you

00:06:41need to do your jobs and keep our communities safe. Now, I must say that I am concerned to

00:06:48see the administration moving to dismantle FEMA and to reduce the resources available

00:06:55for disaster response. Our partners in the field are facing greater challenges

00:07:01in delivering aid to those who need it the most on a timely basis. This hearing is timely as we

00:07:09continue to explore how we can better equip those in the front lines, especially as our resources

00:07:16continue to shrink under this administration. From the California wildfires to hurricanes

00:07:22and flooding in Florida and North Carolina, drones can help frontline personnel respond

00:07:29quickly and effectively to these situations. For example, drones can help first responders

00:07:36find the quickest route to respond to a disaster and assist with search and rescue missions.

00:07:42And as we saw during the terrible fires in Pasadena earlier this year,

00:07:48they can also provide first responders and the public with real-time information.

00:07:55And once disasters are contained, they can also help with damage assessment and identifying safe

00:08:02routes. Technologies such as drones not only help with disaster response, but they also keep our

00:08:10community safe. And drones can enhance public safety by providing real-time situation awareness.

00:08:18They can also help law enforcement monitor and respond to illicit activities at the border

00:08:23such as drug trafficking. And as we can see, drones also have an important role

00:08:31in enhancing public safety. This is why I introduced the bipartisan legislation

00:08:38earlier this year, the Drone Act of 2025, which would allow law enforcement to use federal grants

00:08:45to purchase and operate drones. In my discussions with law enforcement and emergency responders,

00:08:52it is clear that drones play a big and bigger role in saving lives. But as useful as the drones

00:09:00for law enforcement and first responders may be, we also need to prepare for those that use them

00:09:08against us. As ranking member of the Border Security and Enforcement Subcommittee, I've

00:09:15heard that cartels will use drones to carry drugs across the border and surveil men and women of

00:09:22DHS at the front lines. Last year, the top general for U.S. Northern Command testified in the Senate

00:09:30Armed Services Committee that drone incursions along our southern border likely exceed a thousand

00:09:38per month. The threats posed by drones at our border increase the need to understand how DHS

00:09:46uses drones and is it set up sufficiently well to encounter and stop these drones. And I hope

00:09:54the committee will continue to do its good work so that our frontline officers can continue to

00:10:00be equipped to do the best job that they can protecting American citizens. It's also vital

00:10:07that the federal government collaborate with research centers, the private sector, with

00:10:12venture capitalists to develop and adopt cost-effective innovative technologies such as

00:10:18drones and counter drone systems to help confront the challenges that are essentially on top of us

00:10:27now. We in Congress must continue to work together to create constructive opportunities for DHS,

00:10:36our state and local partners, to utilize new technologies to effectively respond to disasters,

00:10:44to save lives, to protect national security, to help trade, travel, and keep our community safe.

00:10:53I look forward to this hearing today, look forward to taking notes from our witnesses

00:10:58about the recommendations you all may have regarding drones, countering drones,

00:11:04and protecting American lives. Thank you Mr. Chairman and with that I yield back.

00:11:10Thank you Ranking Member Correa. I now recognize the Chairman for the Subcommittee on Emergency

00:11:16Management and Technology, the gentleman from Alabama, Mr. Strong, for his opening statement.

00:11:23Good afternoon. Thank you my friend Chairman Michael Guest of Mississippi for leading this

00:11:27important discussion and Ranking Member Correa and to all members for being here today. I want

00:11:33to also thank our witnesses for their time, for sharing their expertise. Let me start by shining a

00:11:39light on my district, Alabama's fifth, which I'm proud to say is well represented on this panel

00:11:44today. As many of you know, Huntsville, Alabama is renowned for its leadership in cutting-edge

00:11:50research and development. As home to Redstone Arsenal, the nation's second largest research

00:11:56park and several universities, Huntsville is a thriving hub for American innovation. I'm glad

00:12:02we have such an excellent panel here and look forward to our discussion. Today we're here to

00:12:07explore how our homeland security partners use unmanned aircraft systems or UAS and how this

00:12:14technology can be a force multiplier for law enforcement, first responders, CBP, and the DHS

00:12:22mission set. Emerging technologies like UAS are reshaping the way we respond to disasters.

00:12:29Drones enable the protection of emergency management personnel in high-risk situations

00:12:34while at the same time increasing the effectiveness of the work that they do. For example, small UAS

00:12:41with sophisticated cameras assist in monitoring critical infrastructure and assessing damage.

00:12:48When equipped with AI, these drones can spot potential flood zones or identify hot spots and

00:12:54wildfires. The data collected from this these flights equip first responders with the tools

00:13:00to better allocate manpower, vehicles, and victim assistance. Larger drones with heavier payload

00:13:07capacity and longer flight times are also critical to tools in disaster management. Rapid deployment

00:13:15and agility enable UAS to access hazardous areas that first responders cannot reach,

00:13:22which proves especially useful when trying to locate survivors or deliver supplies. In response

00:13:29to Hurricane Helene, the Asheville Police Department deployed drones for search and rescue,

00:13:35damage assessment, and overwatch for FEMA. Additionally, pre-positioned UAS in western

00:13:42Florida quickly deployed in response to Hurricane Milton to track the storms and provide real-time

00:13:48data to law enforcement and first responders. 200 flight hours across 16 agencies were recorded

00:13:55representing over 1,000 flights flown in the first days following the storm. This helped to create a

00:14:03common operating picture that enabled first responders to allocate much-needed resources.

00:14:08This technology helped save countless lives in the wake of these moments of the storm. DHS has

00:14:15also utilized UAS to safeguard our borders. They leveraged this technology to protect our homeland

00:14:22from illegal crossings and combat illicit activities such as human and drug smuggling.

00:14:29CBP faces tremendous challenges from dangerous environments and a broadening mission set to

00:14:35adversaries that continue to evolve their tactics and capabilities. Drone technology

00:14:42decreases the workload on CBP agents and provides critical situation awareness

00:14:49to paint a comprehensive picture of the threats impacting our border. Additionally, DHS's Science

00:14:56and Technology Directorate leads government-wide UAS research to counter threats and improve

00:15:03response and recovery operations for disasters. For example, S&T's Air Domain Awareness Program

00:15:11detects, tracks, and identifies aircraft to prevent and respond to criminal activities

00:15:18along the border. Also, S&T's National Urban Security Technology Laboratory

00:15:24manages the SAVER program. This initiative helps emergency responders and law enforcement

00:15:30make informed, cost-effective equipment purchases that meets national standards. And on top of these

00:15:37programs, S&T is leading critical development and counter UAS, ensuring operational components

00:15:44can defend against nefarious actors. This work is supported by universities and industry partners,

00:15:50reflecting a collaborative public-private partnership across all sectors.

00:15:56As the use of these technologies become more commonplace, these partnerships

00:16:01are critical so that UAS can be safely utilized to their fullest potential.

00:16:07I look forward to today's conversation learning more about great work that our witnesses are doing

00:16:13in this space. I'd also like to mention and recognize the CEO of COLSA Corporation, Francisco

00:16:21Collazo, who is not with us today. He's back home at the headquarters in Huntsville, Alabama.

00:16:26He's been a friend of mine for many years and I know that this organization does a phenomenal job.

00:16:32I also want to mention the University of Alabama, Huntsville. I live within five minutes of the

00:16:37University of Alabama in Huntsville and I can tell you today, UAH is a critical part to national

00:16:42security. With an average ACT test score of a 28.5, a little less than 10,000 students,

00:16:49where 80 percent of them choose never to leave after graduation to work in national security.

00:16:55Mr. Chairman, I yield back. It's an honor to be here and I want to thank our guests for joining us.

00:17:00Thank you, Chairman Strong. I now recognize the Ranking Member for the Subcommittee

00:17:04on Emergency Management and Technology, the gentleman from New York, Mr. Kennedy, for his opening statement.

00:17:12Thank you, Chairman, and also thanks to my fellow Ranking Members. Good afternoon. Thank you to each

00:17:21and every one of you for being here today to discuss the use of unmanned aerial systems by

00:17:26the Department of Homeland Security. However, I want to begin by discussing the alarming remarks

00:17:32and actions by the White House and the Department of Homeland Security Secretary Nome.

00:17:38Just last week, Secretary Nome stated on national television that, quote,

00:17:43we are going to eliminate FEMA, end quote. This, disturbingly, received immediate praise

00:17:52from President Trump. Reportedly, Secretary Nome is in active discussions with FEMA leadership

00:18:02about dismantling the agency by October 1st, a reckless move that could leave millions of

00:18:09Americans vulnerable to the impacts of natural disasters like hurricanes, tornadoes, winter storms,

00:18:17wildfires, and floods without any federal assistance. It's deeply concerning that

00:18:25today's hearing isn't solely focused on holding this administration accountable for its plans

00:18:29to dismantle the only federal agency solely dedicated to assisting Americans in the aftermath

00:18:36of disasters. I encourage my Republican colleagues, many of whom have had disasters in their districts,

00:18:42to take action to prevent this administration from doing irreparable harm to the American

00:18:47people by dismantling FEMA. While today's hearing is about drones, the unfortunate reality is that

00:18:54the Trump White House continues to create obstacles that jeopardize the very programs that we're

00:18:59discussing. The Department of Homeland Security's Science and Technology Directorate has played a

00:19:05crucial role in integrating unmanned aerial systems into national security and emergency

00:19:11response efforts. However, the reckless mass firings by Elon Musk and President Trump have

00:19:17hindered S&T's workforce in its capacity to innovate and lead. At the same time, the administration's

00:19:24freeze on federal grants, which is being carried out in violation of court orders, has left

00:19:30communities and first responders unable to secure the vital funding needed for acquiring

00:19:36and deploying drone technology. Grant funding from the Department of Homeland Security has been

00:19:43instrumental in funding local law enforcement seeking to adopt drone technology. However,

00:19:49under Republican House leadership, we've seen a 10% reduction in DHS grant programs in fiscal

00:19:56year 24, followed by similarly inadequate funding levels in fiscal year 25. This has

00:20:02significantly hampered local agencies' ability to acquire critical technology like drones.

00:20:08This is especially impactful for Western New Yorkers, the people I represent, where emergency

00:20:13services, law enforcement, fire departments, and other agencies rely on federal grant funding

00:20:19to deploy drone technologies in disaster response. I can name many different examples of

00:20:27this, but first responders are oftentimes utilizing drone technology in critical

00:20:34missions in my community. For instance, late last year, Buffalo police used drones during

00:20:40extremely cold temperatures to locate and rescue a man who had become disoriented in the snow,

00:20:46bringing him to safety. Without adequate funding, local agencies may be unable to respond to future

00:20:53emergencies as effectively as they otherwise could. Ensuring our local agencies are equipped

00:20:58and funded is not just a matter of policy, but a commitment to the safety and resilience of our

00:21:03communities. I look forward to discussing today how we can promote responsible law enforcement

00:21:09use of drones to equip our first responders with the tools they need to protect and serve

00:21:14effectively. I thank you all for your testimony and your service and look forward to hearing from you.

00:21:20With that, I yield back. Thank you, Chairman. Thank you, Ranking Member Kennedy. Other members of the

00:21:25committee are reminded that opening statements may be submitted for the record. I'm pleased to

00:21:30welcome our panel of witnesses. At this time, I would ask our witnesses to please rise

00:21:36and to please raise your right hand. I will now issue the oath. Do you solemnly swear that the

00:21:48testimony you will give before this Committee on Homeland Security of the United States House of

00:21:53Representatives will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God.

00:22:01Let the record reflect that the witnesses have answered in the affirmative.

00:22:05Thank you and please be seated. I would now like to briefly formally introduce our witnesses.

00:22:14The first witness is Mr. Brian Farrell. Brian is the interim director of the Mississippi State

00:22:20University's Rasput Flight Research Laboratory, which is one of the leading academic research

00:22:26centers dedicated to the advancement of aviation. Mr. Farrell previously led the university's

00:22:32international research partnership and professional development efforts at its

00:22:37international institution. Our second witness is Dr. Michael Ledbetter. Dr. Ledbetter is the

00:22:44executive vice president and chief operating officer at CULSA Corporation, where he oversees

00:22:51strategic operations. Previously, he served as senior vice president for CULSA's cyber

00:22:58information warfare and data science program. Before joining CULSA,

00:23:03Dr. Ledbetter served for 28 years as a United States Marine officer.

00:23:10Our third witness is Mr. Jerry Hendricks. Mr. Hendricks is the director of the UAS program at

00:23:16the University of Alabama in Huntsville, leading all UAS research and testing support, both

00:23:22commercial, military, and government customers. Mr. Hendricks has many years of experience in

00:23:29the aerospace industry. And our final witness is Chief Kevin Fetterman. Chief Fetterman currently

00:23:36serves as division chief for the Orange County Fire Authority, where he leads fire, rescue,

00:23:42and other emergency services. Chief Fetterman is the emerging technology liaison for Orange County

00:23:50and the all hazard incident management team program manager. He has over 29 years of fire

00:24:00and emergency services experience. I would like to thank all our witnesses for being here today.

00:24:07The witnesses' full testimony will appear in the record.

00:24:11I would now recognize Mr. Farrell for five minutes to summarize his opening statement.

00:24:20There we go. Thank you. Good day, Chairman Guest, Chairman Strong, Ranking Members Correa and Kennedy,

00:24:29and the honorable members of the subcommittees. I want to thank you and your staff for welcoming

00:24:33me here today to talk about UAS as it pertains to the needs of the Department of Homeland Security,

00:24:38and more broadly, our domestic security and resiliency. My name is Brian Farrell. I'm the

00:24:44interim director of the Rasput Flight Research Lab at Mississippi State University and the lead

00:24:49for Project Justice. This program is housed within DHS S&T under the Air, Land, and Ports of

00:24:56Entry program. The primary mission is to serve the operational entities within DHS through research,

00:25:02development, testing, integration, and evaluation of UAS and related technologies.

00:25:08Rasput has a proud 75-year history in aerospace research with a keen focus the last 15 years on

00:25:14the newest frontier of aviation, UAS. Rasput maintains a fleet of UAS and manned aircraft,

00:25:20including the largest UAS in academic use, the NAVMAR-TEROS. Rasput leverages MSU property and

00:25:26external partnerships to operate at a myriad of test locations to include restricted airspace,

00:25:32as well as over 75,000 square miles of FAA-authorized airspace. We are also the house

00:25:39of the Assure Center of Excellence for UAS for the FAA, where we work with 32 other universities

00:25:46and test sites to integrate UAS into the national airspace system. Through our designations and

00:25:51expertise, we serve industry, government partners to advance UAS technologies for their missions.

00:25:57In the spirit of today's hearing, I hope to provide insights not only into the benefits

00:26:01and use cases of UAS, but also an understanding of the considerations and efforts that support

00:26:06the integration of this technology. UAS are common in daily operations across industry and

00:26:10government alike. These aircraft augment and enhance capabilities and provide perspectives

00:26:15that operational units may not always be able to access. Drones provide situational awareness

00:26:20paramount to individual safety and security, whether that be in the execution of high-risk

00:26:24law enforcement activity or in the aftermath of a disaster where life-saving operations are

00:26:29underway. DHS component missions require integration of different UAS platforms,

00:26:34sensors, and operational parameters. Even within a single DHS component such as CBP,

00:26:39you see a vast different usage of UAS types. For example, broad area border surveillance requires

00:26:46a platform capable of the necessary endurance and operational distance, while an agent engaged

00:26:52in tactical operations may need to carry a small UAS that can be deployed in confined environments.

00:26:58Beyond the UAS selected, the components also need to establish protocols and flight authorizations.

00:27:03They need to understand sensors and sensor availabilities for the platforms and how that

00:27:07data will be viewed, stored, and distributed. They need to make decisions based on the cost

00:27:11and maintenance of the aircraft, and all of these considerations exist within a policy backdrop

00:27:16and legal constraints about where the device is made and the critical components come from.

00:27:21These are just some of the variables that underpin how UAS get employed within the

00:27:25DHS enterprise. Why UAS get deployed comes down to efficiency and safety. Looking at the last

00:27:31two examples, traditional broad area surveillance requires expensive crewed aircraft, a network of

00:27:36sensors, or something like a satellite feed. These options can be expensive and can oftentimes be

00:27:41unreliable. A UAS, by contrast, efficiently integrates into ground operations at a lower

00:27:46initial and operational cost point, while potentially having greater endurance and a

00:27:50higher quality data feed. The tactical community is a great example of enhanced safety. Portability

00:27:56and maneuverability are paramount when these teams are executing high-risk operations.

00:28:01A manned, portable, small UAS can be rapidly deployed to provide situational awareness,

00:28:06crucial for informed decision making. Shifting gears from law enforcement to emergency management,

00:28:12this past hurricane season provided countless examples of UAS being utilized for response and

00:28:17recovery. Grassroots Own Operations supported Region 4 UAS remote sensing coordinator and other

00:28:22stakeholders in leveraging our largest UAS, the Teros, for disaster response, where in the

00:28:27aftermath we broadcast live video and live tiled imagery to a myriad of stakeholders,

00:28:33including the White House. This facilitated faster response, faster recovery, and significantly

00:28:40improved the damage assessments. RASPID is quite fortunate to engage deeply in all aspects of UAS,

00:28:46including the technical and regulatory complexities required to operationalize.

00:28:51It provides us with a good vantage point to understand those pesky,

00:28:54it depends scenarios that often arise around UAS. I look forward to engaging more deeply

00:28:59about our work at Mississippi State University and providing greater insights into the benefits

00:29:03of UAS for DHS and the needs associated with integrating this technology. Thank you.

00:29:09Thank you, Mr. Farrell. I now recognize Dr. Ledbetter for five minutes to summarize his

00:29:14opening statement. Good afternoon, Chairman Strong and guests, Ranking Members Kennedy and Correa

00:29:20and members of the subcommittee. I'm Mike Ledbetter, Chief Operating Officer for Coles

00:29:24Corporation, a Huntsville, Alabama-based engineering services firm and drone manufacturer.

00:29:30On behalf of our founder and chairman, 30-year Army veteran, Mr. Frank Calazzo,

00:29:34I'm pleased to testify before your subcommittees today to discuss the importance

00:29:38of promoting innovation, security, and the unmanned aircraft systems industry.

00:29:42Coles began designing, developing, and manufacturing small UASs in 2019.

00:29:47Since then, we've manufactured and delivered over 1,400 UASs to the Army, developed software

00:29:52to swarm large numbers of UASs, and recently developed a line of commercially available UASs.

00:29:57The concept for Coles's original work was developed as lower-cost systems with increasing

00:30:02capability began flooding the commercial market. At the same time, the threat from swarms of UASs

00:30:07was becoming better understood. Some of these risks include saturating air defense systems,

00:30:13electronic warfare capabilities able to jam communications, disrupt radars,

00:30:17or spoof the location of enemy systems. Coles is now a leading provider of low-cost,

00:30:22non-developmental, deployable Group 1 and Group 2 swarm UASs. These systems support

00:30:26unit training and operations and aid in testing counter-UAS technologies. The program also provides

00:30:33soldiers with a low workload, easy-to-use command and control system, enabling a single operator to

00:30:38control a swarm up to 100 UASs simultaneously. In 2023, Coles invested in an internal research

00:30:46and development IRAD program to leverage our extensive domain expertise and talent pool to

00:30:50develop UAS designs that are better suited for commercial and civil agency applications,

00:30:56with an array of sensors and payloads to address several emergency response and border security

00:31:00use cases, such as delivering medical and humanitarian supplies, search and rescue,

00:31:06disaster assessment, and communications resiliency. One of the challenges the industry

00:31:11faces is balancing the availability of new UASs components and features that address genuine needs

00:31:18with the ability to obtain independent third-party compliance assessments. As the committee is aware,

00:31:23federal and government agencies are restricted from procuring or operating UASs or UAS components

00:31:29manufactured by foreign entities. The dilemma, however, is that there are very few certifying

00:31:35bodies that can assess UASs and ensure they meet the strict security and compliance standards.

00:31:40Further, the organizations that do exist operate with the resources too limited

00:31:44to maintain the pace with UAS innovation. For example, the Defense Innovation Unit, DIU,

00:31:50held a blue UAS refresh challenge with the purpose of verifying the submitted systems

00:31:55compliance with the supply chain restrictions and cybersecurity best practices. There were 369

00:32:01submissions that participated in this once a year refresh challenge. However, there were

00:32:06only enough resources to accept 23 platforms and 14 other components. These rates do not

00:32:13match the pace that American drone manufacturers are producing new systems or developing advanced

00:32:18technologies that could support emergency management or border security use cases.

00:32:23The impact is that federal and state agencies who had previously invested in fleets of UASs

00:32:27manufactured in restricted nations now have very few and increasingly expensive options for

00:32:33bringing their UAS operations into compliance. COLSA is well positioned and well structured to

00:32:38do business with these government agencies at very low risk. However, there's a challenging

00:32:42process to be evaluated and certified for sales to either defense or civil agencies.

00:32:46For UASs to be able to reach their potential in the use cases mentioned, several technologies need

00:32:52to be developed and matured to include, but not limited to, beyond visual line-of-sight,

00:32:57BVLOS, operations that require long-range communications over a variety of networks

00:33:02with reliable data links for real-time data transmission. Artificial intelligence and

00:33:07onboard processing must progress so that UASs can detect and avoid obstacles,

00:33:12self-determine route planning, and make mission-driven decisions during BVLOS operations.

00:33:17Battery technology struggles to provide the necessary power for extended flight times.

00:33:22Currently, China still manufactures 70 to 80 percent of the world's lithium-ion batteries.

00:33:26We thank Congress for securing the UAS technology supply chain as it is an essential step to shore

00:33:32up vulnerabilities from foreign exploitation. To maintain capacity and allow for greater competition

00:33:38in the market, we must open the aperture in approving compliant UAS technologies and platforms

00:33:43for both defense and civil agency use. This could be achieved through streamlined evaluations,

00:33:49additional certifying bodies, and automation. Finally, we hope you will support research and

00:33:55development in the technology areas that support BVLOS operations, improve domestic production

00:34:00capacity, and improve battery technology. I greatly appreciate the opportunity to address

00:34:05this committee and would happily take your questions. Thank you. Thank you, Dr. Ledbetter.

00:34:10I now recognize Mr. Hendricks for five minutes to summarize his opening statement.

00:34:16Good afternoon, Chairman Guest and strong and ranking members Correa and Kennedy

00:34:20and the subcommittees. On behalf of myself, Jerry Hendricks, and our 130 center employees,

00:34:24all who are U.S. citizens and are cleared, the University of Alabama brings you greetings from

00:34:29Alabama. Thank you for inviting us up today to testify and thank you for you and your staff

00:34:35service to the American people. We really appreciate that. UAH ranks sixth and fairly

00:34:40funding in aeronautical and aerospace research. Our center specializes in autonomous research

00:34:45focusing on unmanned aircraft systems and counter unmanned aircraft systems. Our disaster response

00:34:50research has been recognized nationally by the Commercial Drone Alliance in testimony before

00:34:55Congress in 2023. UAH's research with exercises across natural and human-made disasters was

00:35:01identified as one of the top eight UAS programs to bring benefit to the American people. Over the

00:35:07past 20 years, I've been involved in over 4,000 development operations training and policy

00:35:11development programs and separate incidents in testing, exercise, and disaster response.

00:35:17Some of our center's research capabilities include UAS use in disaster exercises,

00:35:22water operations, and real disasters, worldwide unmanned aircraft systems threat analysis,

00:35:28development of unmanned aircraft systems as threat replicas, and also role play and development

00:35:33of unmanned aircraft systems and use by the DOD. Our center also supports FAA UAS research and trains

00:35:39DOJ agents and UAS use. Drone technology is advancing and evolving and offers great benefit

00:35:46to the DHS enterprise. We need three things. DHS focused innovations, clear and controllable

00:35:53airspace, and special provisions for training, exercise, and operations. UAH's research has

00:35:59resulted in many operations. Here's just a few. Of concern, operational disciplines across the UAS

00:36:04domain, especially when it comes to operational procedures, compliance, and controlling the

00:36:08operational environment for unmanned UAS operators. Some responders noted to us that

00:36:14the air responses are really the wild west. Consistent operational procedures with checklists,

00:36:19UAS checklists, and even more checklists must be used for any safe operation in response.

00:36:24The training and credentialing of operators to a standard set of minimal operational

00:36:28proficiency standards is a must. Research, training, and exercises and operations are

00:36:34overburdened by regulations and processes imposed by multiple agents. We must be able to research

00:36:39and train as we respond and conduct missions. And responders and agents must be able to protect our

00:36:45own assets and our transportation infrastructure from unwanted, sometimes nefarious, UAS incursions.

00:36:51Therefore, county UAS systems must be tested and validated against certified threats by

00:36:56independent agents. And the surrounding environments must be characterized for possible impacts. Today,

00:37:03most UAS systems are becoming just too expensive. Introducing new technologies and innovations are

00:37:08needed. Regulatory restrictions, process, and documentation cannot force unnecessary technological

00:37:14constraints that drive cost. New technology for controlling the airspace via the automated air

00:37:19boss, use of autonomy, swarming artificial intelligence, machine learning, beyond visual

00:37:24line-of-sight operations, and technologies offer the ability to respond more rapidly and effectively.

00:37:29Research is needed to incorporate these two new technologies and must be adjusted to allow safe

00:37:34introduction. Such technology insertion research could be part of a DHS innovation program

00:37:40to identify novel UAS technology that is simple, low-cost, highly productive to mission needs,

00:37:45and rapidly reconfigurable to adjust to the mission as it adjusts. The results would be a DHS meeting

00:37:50need set of UAS that is being made and manufactured in America. And we should allow realistic use of

00:37:56national airspace in the location of UAS and test UAS ranges like, for example, at the Huntsville

00:38:01International Airport with appropriate waivers. Additionally, cooperative threat analysis across

00:38:07multiple agents is needed. For the borders, UAS open source threat analysis that we just ran

00:38:12shows the following. Cartels are using UAS for surveillance. Fiber optic control UAS are at the

00:38:18border. Drones dropping bomblets and incendiary devices are also there. This capability from came

00:38:23from the Ukraine-Russian war and is now available to be purchased online, making it easily available.

00:38:29We have seen multiple drone carriers as well from manned aircraft and morphing structures.

00:38:34In conclusion, support is needed for effective and efficient responses. I ask for the committee's

00:38:40assistance in allowing DHS enterprise more leeway and freedom to research, test, and conduct

00:38:44exercises. Changing regulations for this support and allocating more resources for more research

00:38:49and supporting technology will allow a more effective, efficient, and real-world-like response.

00:38:54We need to train and exercise as we operate. And we need an innovation program that would

00:38:58generate UAS technology specified by DHS that is DHS-focused. Simply use low-cost,

00:39:04reconfigurable, and highly developed to mission needs. Thank you for your attention and consideration.

00:39:09I look forward to continuing discussions. I want to assure that UH will continue to support

00:39:13and research to protect our citizenry, assist our soldiers and agents, get disaster victims on the

00:39:18road to recovery faster, and save lives. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Hendricks. I now recognize

00:39:24Chief Fetterman for five minutes to summarize his opening statement.

00:39:30Good afternoon, Chairman Guest, Ranking Member Correa, Chairman Strong, and Ranking Member

00:39:34Kennedy. I'm Division IV Chief Kevin Fetterman of the Orange County Fire Authority. Today I'm

00:39:39representing the International Association of Fire Chiefs. I appreciate the opportunity to discuss UAS

00:39:44and the role they play in the Department of Homeland Security's enterprise. Fire and EMS

00:39:49departments across the nation are beginning to deploy UAS during emergency operations. UAS

00:39:55provides a number of capabilities to improve emergency response operations and reduce life

00:40:00and property loss. From the perspective of an incident commander, it is key to gain situational

00:40:06awareness at the beginning and maintain it throughout an incident. UAS provides real-time

00:40:12data about the incident scene through aerial high-resolution imagery plus videos. Thermal

00:40:18imaging by UAS can determine the spread of a fire or the potential hot spots outside the line

00:40:24of a wildland fire. The LIDAR capabilities of a UAS can be used to assess landslides and mud and

00:40:31debris flows. UAS can also be used to identify subjects during search and rescue missions and

00:40:37for operational missions like delivering supplies or conducting firing operations during wildland

00:40:43fires. The September 2024 airport fire demonstrated the utility of public safety UAS.

00:40:51The OCFA deployed its UAS early to gain necessary situational awareness. During the incident we used

00:40:58local and federal UAS with infrared cameras to track the fire and determine the extent

00:41:03the remaining hot spots. While the fire covered 23,519 acres and burned more than 160 structures,

00:41:12it still provided a great example of how interagency collaboration can manage an incident

00:41:17successfully in a high-complexity environment. During wildland fires and other major incidents,

00:41:22it is important to integrate operations of multiple emergency response aircraft. In California,

00:41:28the fire traffic areas are established to provide coordination between helicopters,

00:41:33fixed-wing air tankers, command and control aircraft, UAS and other aircraft. The FAA also

00:41:41institutes temporary flight restrictions, also known as TFRs, to ensure the safety of first

00:41:46responders as they engage in emergency operations. The January 2025 LA fires demonstrated the

00:41:53advantages and risks of UAS use. For example, public safety UAS provided real-time information

00:42:01and data on the fires in Pacific Palisades and other localities. However, public recreational

00:42:07UAS incursions created great risks to our operations. Between January 7th and January 25th,

00:42:15there were more than 700 incursions by more than 400 different UAS. One UAS flight was

00:42:22recorded at a level of 20,000 feet and in another a public UAS operator lost track of his aircraft

00:42:28and it hit a Canadian super scooper. It put a hole about this size in the wing.

00:42:34This accident endangered the lives of the crew,

00:42:38endangered the lives of first responders on the ground, and grounded the aircraft.

00:42:44We ask Congress and the federal government to take action to protect emergency operations

00:42:49from these UAS incursions. Specifically, we recommend passing legislation that would thwart

00:42:55pilots of UAS incursions into fire traffic areas and TFRs. Legal protections should be in place

00:43:03to maximize the ability of first responders to save lives. Formulating and implementing

00:43:09clear UAS mitigation procedures, identifying federal law enforcement personnel and processes

00:43:15for eliminating threats to public safety operations, enhancing remote ID requirements

00:43:21and reducing remote ID bypasses, establishing formal coordination plans with all relevant

00:43:27local, state, and federal stakeholders, implementing effective public awareness campaigns

00:43:33and developing continuing education for the public about the safe operations of UAS, and lastly,

00:43:38encouraging UAS manufacturers to develop solutions that universally support the emergency operations

00:43:44of American first responders. In closing, thank you for the opportunity to testify at today's

00:43:50hearing. Fire and emergency EMS departments are embracing the various benefits that UAS can

00:43:56provide for their emergency response operations. By coordinating the use of federal, state, and

00:44:01local UAS, the incident commanders can get a better understanding of emergency incidents,

00:44:06and even identify and provide resources to victims. However, we must work to make the airspace safer

00:44:13for our emergency responders. The federal government needs to be more aggressive

00:44:17in developing and enforcing restrictions on public UAS incursions into TFRs.

00:44:23As we tell the public in California, if you fly, we can't. I look forward to answering any

00:44:30questions that you may have. Thank you, and I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you, Chief

00:44:35Fetterman. Members will be recognized by order of seniority for their five minutes of questioning.

00:44:41An additional round of questioning may be called after all members have been recognized.

00:44:46I now recognize myself for five minutes of questioning. Director Farrell, thank you for

00:44:53being here today. We have seen that recent concerns over privacy, public safety, and national security

00:45:03have led to restrictions on drones from certain foreign manufacturers.

00:45:08Given these concerns and these restrictions, how is the industry affected by requirements

00:45:14imposed by the National Defense Authorization Act? Thank you, Chairman Guest.

00:45:23So, I believe that the United States industry is playing catch-up. I think that the commercial

00:45:33market and first responders have had access to cheaper Chinese technology in particular

00:45:40for quite a while. I think that we had heard testimony around the program that

00:45:47DIU has that has certainly led to advancements and investment in U.S. manufacturing. I think

00:45:56that the CHIPS Act and other efforts in order to bring the technology back here to invest in the

00:46:03critical components, the autopilots, the camera systems, have made a lot of headway. If you'd

00:46:09asked me this question several years ago, I think I would have said we're pretty far away, but

00:46:15recent investments, recent technology is really showing vast improvements. The work that we're

00:46:20doing through Project Justice is meant to support DHS components in their procurement processes.

00:46:28You heard about the bottleneck at DIU. One way that we're trying to support industry here

00:46:35is to give them an alternative pathway for DHS procurement processes where we do our own vetting,

00:46:40we do our own cyber vulnerability assessments, as well as critical component analysis,

00:46:45and that opens the door for DHS components as they choose to request and look at different

00:46:51technologies to be able to give other manufacturers an opportunity to sell and to

00:46:58ensure that the components have a safe product at the end of the day. All that to say is the

00:47:05NDA requirements have truly caused some bottlenecks, but we are working rapidly to

00:47:11try to alleviate those and enhance the American product and as well as ensure the safe operations.

00:47:18And Director Farrell, you mentioned Project Justice, a partnership between DHS S&T

00:47:26and the Rasput Flight Center there located at Mississippi State University. Could one,

00:47:32you just give us a kind of a brief overview of Project Justice and then you mentioned just a

00:47:39moment ago, but maybe go into a little bit more detail the work being done to support the

00:47:45Department of Homeland Security. Absolutely. So, Project Justice was started as the common UAS

00:47:50test site back in 2016. We exist now in our current iteration as Justice NextGen. It's the joint

00:47:58unmanned systems testing and a collaborative environment program under the air, land,

00:48:02and ports of entry portfolio. As a part of this work, we support all of the components

00:48:08for their UAS testing as well as research and development needs as it relates to UAS,

00:48:14as well as other associated technologies. So, as DHS gets a gap within the UAS world,

00:48:23they'll reach out to us to be able to analyze that. And this can take many different forms.

00:48:28It can be looking at the landscape of commercial available products. It can be examining what

00:48:36exists within our research portfolio to understand what can fit that space.

00:48:42It can also be custom UAS development. We've developed UAS that the market wasn't providing

00:48:48for HSI, an entry level drone that had some really great capabilities. And it can also be

00:48:56items where, like air domain awareness, we just delivered a tool for DHS that provides air domain

00:49:04awareness, leveraging the beyond visual line of sight capabilities that remote ID are meant to

00:49:11provide. And then also a broadcast or an ATAC system to give situational awareness. And we

00:49:20demoed that actually at the university's campus around a football game scenario.

00:49:28We've also leveraged the program to support FEMA Region 4. So, we actually flew the Teros

00:49:36in support for Helene as well as Debbie. And that was a really great showcase of a 44-foot

00:49:44wingspan aircraft, 24 hours of endurance that can distribute live video and tiled imagery.

00:49:51Those are just some of the things we're doing. But truly, I think that the portfolio,

00:49:57given the partnerships, given the collaborations with our Ashore Center of Excellence, as well as

00:50:05the other industry partners, really opens the gamut for what we can provide to DHS.

00:50:10Thank you, Director Fairless. My time has now expired. I would like to recognize

00:50:15Ranking Member Correa for five minutes for any questions he may have.

00:50:19Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Fetterman, you oversee the Command and Emergency Planning

00:50:25Division of the largest fire agency in Orange County, nearly two million residents across

00:50:3178 fire stations. You have a lot of experience with search and rescue and planning missions.

00:50:39How do emerging technologies like drone technology help keep Orange County residents safe?

00:50:50Ranking Member Correa, thank you for the question. I appreciate the opportunity to answer it.

00:50:55Orange County Fire is fortunate, under the leadership of Fire Chief Brian Fennessy,

00:51:00to lean fairly into emerging technology. We see it as an important aspect of meeting the threats

00:51:08that we face. We utilize every opportunity to engage in emerging technology, such as AI cameras

00:51:16for fire detection. And as you pointed out, we utilize a significant fleet of drones. We utilize

00:51:23on the fire line to determine and look for hot spots, especially outside of the line. Those are

00:51:31areas of the fire that you might not be able to see from the ground. But using the aerial

00:51:36observation and gaining that situational awareness, you can find spots that could

00:51:39turn into a significant fire later, especially if there are spots in between the fire line.

00:51:45Identifying those spots before they flare up save countless lives, millions if not billions

00:51:53of dollars in damage. You mentioned 150 structures recently burned in Orange County. Boy, when those

00:52:02fires go, they really go quickly. Technology, emerging technology, private sector, public sector.

00:52:10Recently, Elon Musk attempted to fire 400 employees at DHS. Some of those employees were at the

00:52:18Department of Science and Technology Directorate, which is really in charge of R&D, figuring out

00:52:23better ways, keeping Americans safe. They were developing, testing, and evaluating tools to help

00:52:30firefighters navigate in dark, smoke-filled buildings, how to rescue trapped civilians,

00:52:38communicate with firefighters, first responders. Can you speak to the importance of making sure

00:52:43that kind of research and development is developed as quickly as possible?

00:52:49Yes, so certainly I would say that the DHS science and technology is a critical aspect.

00:52:55We utilize that technology. We're leaning into firefighter tracking and identifying where our

00:53:01personnel are, and that's not an easy task. We have to leverage all available technology to do

00:53:07that. So, emerging technology and even the bigger support of FEMA programs like the National Fire

00:53:14Academy and the U.S. Fire Administration, those are all critical to the fire service. Those are

00:53:20the backbones of our leadership programs and our ability to educate and teach our new and

00:53:27upcoming fire service leaders. Mr. Fetterman, we're talking about the affirmative use of drones.

00:53:34What about the defensive side in emerging technologies? You just talked about

00:53:39what I would consider a knucklehead, a drone flying in an active emergency situation.

00:53:48I'd say these people have no common sense. I don't care how criminal you make it,

00:53:52they're going to do dumb things. So, I would imagine the emerging technologies that we can

00:53:57come up with to clear the field, so to speak, so you can do work is also an important part of the

00:54:02emerging technology. Yes, sir. So, seeing the report of the number of drone incursions on the

00:54:10fires in L.A. was frankly shocking to see that number of drone incursions into a fire traffic

00:54:16area. And what that is, is you're talking about multiple aircrafts, 30 helicopters, six to eight

00:54:22fixed wing air tankers. And so, all operating to extinguish and mitigate the fire. And so,

00:54:27when you have drone incursions in there, we need to do, we and ideally this committee and

00:54:33Congress altogether, needs to take swift action to mitigate those incursions into our fire traffic

00:54:41areas and specifically the TFRs. It's an incredibly dangerous situation. Chief, in my last 35 seconds,

00:54:47we've established that drone technology, emerging technology, very important, very useful, also very

00:54:53dangerous. How can we in Congress help you do your job better? Well, certainly, the emerging

00:55:03technology is critically important to us, leaning into that, supporting legislation that protects

00:55:08the first responders. And as I mentioned, the National Fire Academy is our leadership backbone.

00:55:15That's where all of our leaders that bring that vision to engage into emerging technology come

00:55:21from. They're coming out of programs like the Executive Fire Officer Program. And certainly,

00:55:27the support of all the grant programs, AFG, SAFER, SHISHGAP, UASI, those are the types of programs

00:55:35that help the first responders at the boots on the ground, boots in the dirt level, to continue to

00:55:41evolve. So I'd encourage this group to continue to support those programs. Chief Fetterman, thank you

00:55:46for joining us today and look forward to continue working with you. Thank you, sir. So, Chairman,

00:55:50I'm out of time, but before I do turn over my time, I'd like the unanimous consent to insert

00:55:57into a record an article from the GHS Science and Tech Directorate dated November 6th of 23, titled

00:56:05Picturing the Future of Firefighters, which describes how science and technology serves a

00:56:10crucial role in R&D and testing technologies alongside the private sector to help our

00:56:16firefighters and other first responders to respond safely to emergencies and save lives.

00:56:21Without objection. Thank you. I now recognize Chairman Strong for five minutes. To effectively

00:56:30counter emerging threats, it's important to understand enemy capabilities and the technologies

00:56:35that are evolving in this space. Dr. Ledbetter, I know CULSA designs and produces swarming threat

00:56:41representative drones for the Army, but can this technology be used for other purposes?

00:56:48Absolutely. We've used swarming drones to create asymmetry on the battlefield

00:56:55that can be used in a positive manner as well. For a couple of things. One, we use multiple

00:57:02transmission methods. That creates resiliency. When communications go down in a humanitarian

00:57:12assistance disaster recovery type situation, that can provide resilience and communication.

00:57:17That's one aspect that can be used. The second aspect could be coverage. With swarms, you're

00:57:25just going to get more coverage instead of just one drone. You mentioned in one of the opening

00:57:33statements about MQ-9. It's one drone. It's a very powerful, powerful drone. However, we can provide

00:57:39a swarm up to 100 from a single laptop. That can provide more coverage with more sensors. That can

00:57:46do a lot of essentially 100 different missions. So yes, it could absolutely be repurposed.

00:57:51While we're on the topic of drone technology, we also hear a lot about technological advancement

00:57:56in drones as they relate to AI decision-making. Dr. Ledbetter, what role do you see for these

00:58:03technologies within the DHS and first responder mission spaces? What advancements are likely

00:58:10on the horizon? We'll start with just AI. We use that term a lot.

00:58:19Drone-to-drone communication using large language models to incorporate artificial

00:58:24intelligence and machine learning into the swarms helps them automate not only their flight

00:58:30path, but automate response. We've heard about drone in a box, where you have drones pre-positioned

00:58:37and without anybody actually controlling the drone, you can use AI to respond to some incident or

00:58:45a variety of incidents, whether it be a lost person at night or whether it be an accident

00:58:51on the interstate. Thank you. Everyone here understands the essential role that colleges,

00:58:56universities, and other academic institutions play in supporting the research, testing,

00:59:02and evaluation of new and emerging technologies. Mr. Hendricks, your program at the University

00:59:07of Alabama in Huntsville has advanced both government and industry use of aerospace

00:59:13and autonomous engineering solutions. Could you expand on the value that UAH and other

00:59:18academic institutions offer that differ from industry and why this is advantageous to DHS?

00:59:27Thank you for the question, Chairman Strong. We appreciate that. Part of the research that

00:59:30we're doing in autonomy includes looking at advanced algorithms and development relative

00:59:35to artificial intelligence or machine learning, looking at things that are known as leader,

00:59:39follower, or multi-application operations. We have the ability to operate in close proximity

00:59:45to the university and also in the university to test out those certain kinds of paradigms.

00:59:51It gives us the ability to look at those algorithms and refine those developments

00:59:55in a more of a research standpoint so we can come up with a solution that

00:59:59organizations like CULSA could develop and then produce. One of the things we were able to

01:00:03recently do for the DOD side is a customer brought to us a very specialized requirement.

01:00:09I need you to build the capability to do XYZ. I need you to have it built in a modular sense.

01:00:14Can you do it in six months? We did. We developed that and now it's ready for production.

01:00:19Very impressive. Given the increasing importance of UAS and rapid response scenarios, it raises

01:00:25an important question about how our regulations and processes are evolving to keep pace. Mr.

01:00:31Hendricks, in your opinion, with the increased use and capability of drones, are there any UAS

01:00:38regulations or processes that need to be adjusted? Yes, sir, absolutely. If you look at the counter

01:00:44UAS side, for example, we deal with it and I mentioned these in the testimony, the different

01:00:48types of regulations that need to be adjusted to allow us to do a full set of testing in the

01:00:54counter UAS area, whether it also be detection or mitigation. We're working with DHS on that,

01:01:01but we have been unable to, because of regulation, be able to do full testing.

01:01:05Again, we test and we need to be able to test as we operate. And those partnerships are very

01:01:10valuable. In the previous administration, for every drone flown by Border Patrol, the Mexican

01:01:17cartel flew 17, many times entering U.S. airspace to land and offload pounds of fentanyl in an

01:01:26attempt to kill a generation of Americans. What is most interesting in Huntsville, Alabama,

01:01:33we have the proven technology to neutralize that drone threat. We can intercept and do forensics,

01:01:40we can block their flight, or we can drop and destroy them. Our time is now. I thank each of

01:01:47you for being here today. Your information is very valuable. And again, thank you each for being here.

01:01:53Thank you, Chairman Strong. I now recognize the gentleman from New York, ranking member

01:01:59Kennedy, for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Chairman. And again, thanks to each

01:02:04of you for your testimony. Also, Dr. Ledbetter, thank you for your 30 years of service in the

01:02:10United States Marine Corps. Extremely impressive. So I represent a congressional district,

01:02:19Buffalo-Niagara region in western New York, and we have our own fair share of extreme weather,

01:02:25and oftentimes it's extreme winter weather. We average over 90 inches of snowfall each winter.

01:02:35A few years back, Christmas weekend, over 48 hours, there was over 50 inches of snow that dropped,

01:02:44along with blinding wind and low zero temperatures. It was a blizzard, winter storm Elliot,

01:02:53breaking record numbers, and 47 people perished in my community, just to give you an idea

01:02:59of the impact of this storm. I mentioned earlier in my opening remarks how the local law enforcement

01:03:07used drone technology to find an individual that had been lost in a wooded area using

01:03:14infrared technology. And of course, Chief Fetterman, you're speaking to the impact of

01:03:21drone technology during wildfires, all of these natural disasters that are occurring with

01:03:29more ferociousness and certainly more often. Chief Fetterman, can you describe the importance

01:03:37of testing and piloting drones in emergencies that are caused by these extreme weather events?

01:03:47Yes, sir, Ranking Member Kennedy, thank you for the question. So certainly the last time you

01:03:52want to put a drone up is the first time. So what we want to ensure is that our personnel,

01:03:57when they're using drones for life safety, is to ensure they have plenty of opportunities to

01:04:02be prepared and they're well trained. And so we can leverage the technology, example IR technology,

01:04:10in a remote rescue environment safely, professionally, and most importantly, quickly.

01:04:17You know, time is life in our business. And so having that preparation in blue sky days

01:04:25is most important. That way our folks are ready and prepared to go to work when the time is right.

01:04:31Thank you. Are there ways the federal government can help with these test cases?

01:04:37So certainly, as I stated, the support of grants that can assist with

01:04:45the testing process and the training process. For example, recently we used UASI grants

01:04:52for an incident management team training that revolved around drone swarms and aircraft and

01:05:00what would occur. So our personnel, and that was an operational area-wide, county-wide

01:05:07program test and training, is making us better prepared to respond.

01:05:13Thank you. And Chief Fetterman, can you speak to how the federal agencies support fire response?

01:05:23I'm personally extremely concerned about the impacts on local first responders that the cuts

01:05:30to FEMA and NOAA will have. Can you speak to the agency's support?

01:05:38Sure. So certainly there are impacts to the fire service. Specifically under FEMA,

01:05:46U.S. Fire Administration is an essential element for fire service leadership

01:05:52and the American Fire Service. As I stated, the National Fire Academy is the backbone

01:05:57of our leadership. It's analogous to the Navy War College. It is important to our fire service

01:06:04leadership to be educated. Certainly the grants, as I think as we mentioned, the funding opportunities

01:06:10to leverage to get those tools into the hands of the local first responders that are responding

01:06:15on federal responsibility area land. And lastly, our fire department and many fire departments and

01:06:22police departments across this nation participate in the National Urban Search and Rescue System.

01:06:27And that is a system that I personally deployed within a handful of states and supported local

01:06:34first responders. The National Urban Search and Rescue System and its 28 national task forces

01:06:40is a critical element of FEMA and it responds on every national disaster.

01:06:48For example, every hurricane, mud and debris flow, flooding, the surface site building collapse

01:06:56in Florida. Those are elements and areas that those task forces respond and support all the

01:07:02local entities. And I can't say enough about how well and what a cost effective resource those are

01:07:08because those aren't federal responders all the time. Those are hosted by the home agency. So

01:07:13it's a great program. I have more questions but I'm out of time. Yeah, I yield back. Thank you.

01:07:18Thank you. I now recognize the gentlelady from South Carolina for her five minutes of questioning,

01:07:24Ms. Biggs. Thank you, Chairman Guest. I want to thank you for holding this hearing today,

01:07:34especially considering the recent wildfires that have impacted my own district. My thoughts and

01:07:41prayers are with the families and the first responders and the entire communities impacted

01:07:47by these fires. I have been on the ground alongside state and local leadership and I

01:07:54want to be as helpful as possible. I have been inspired by the way our community has come

01:07:59together. That's the spirit of South Carolina and that's something to be proud of. Earlier today,

01:08:06I received a message that so far in my district, 12,652 acres have burned with 30 percent containment

01:08:17and that was a little earlier today. This is the second record-setting natural disaster that my

01:08:24constituents have faced in the last six months. The upstate is resilient and it will rebuild.

01:08:33So my question is to Mr. Farrell. Can you describe the coordination between your organization,

01:08:40federal and local entities, as you engaged in the response to Hurricane Helene?

01:08:47And the second question on that is what capabilities do you foresee drones being

01:08:54equipped within future disaster responses and how might this expand the future missions of drones

01:09:01in emergency response situations?

01:09:08Thank you, Congresswoman. So the coordination is one where, especially in Region 4, we're very

01:09:16fortunate on the remote sensing side to have a collaborative collection plan. It's really a model

01:09:23that doesn't exist in any of the other regions currently. So our partnership with Region 4

01:09:29stemmed out of work that's gone back about eight years with NOAA to assess flood mapping and

01:09:35monitoring missions through our NOAA cooperative, the Northern Gulf Institute, and our Geosystems

01:09:41Research Institute. The FEMA Region 4 took notice of the large UAS operations and reached out

01:09:49through that federal collaboration to begin investigating the opportunity for a large UAS to

01:09:56engage in these kinds of disasters given the broad area type surveillance that we can be able to

01:10:02provide and that endurance. So we begin doing blue sky exercises through Project Justice to really

01:10:09illustrate that integration into the FEMA operation. And so when a storm, especially around

01:10:20hurricanes, begins posing its threat to our region, the collaborative collection plan is put in place.

01:10:28The region coordinates with all of the stakeholders, including the state and local

01:10:31emergency management agencies, to understand what their needs are. FEMA will reach out to us

01:10:37and then we will pre-position as best as possible to be able to respond.

01:10:42And as we get in, we on daily calls talk about areas and targets and interests for ingress,

01:10:49egress, damage assessment, search and rescue, and then we will get mission assigned and broadcast

01:10:55out as we collect the information necessary. Because we're doing this in a live fashion,

01:11:01we're actually doing it through a distributed teams call with our pilots. They can reassign

01:11:07us as needed while we're in the air. As far as capabilities and the future for this mission,

01:11:13I think that, you know, we had the conversation about autonomy. Autonomy is going to play a large

01:11:18role, whether that's thrown in the box or greater capabilities around sensors, greater capability

01:11:23around platforms, more ubiquitous type platforms in this type of disaster response. One of the

01:11:31things we're doing is doing assured safe training to actually train first responders in these kinds

01:11:35of missions, understand the airspace management that exists and do the training for airspace

01:11:40managers, your air boss, if you will. And then what we also want to do is work with our state

01:11:47and locals to be able to enhance their preparedness and understand what the constructs are and what

01:11:54contracts and what kind of needs need to be in place so that, at least in Mississippi on our

01:11:59land grant mission, we can prepare our community for response from kind of a grassroots perspective.

01:12:06Thank you. And I'm just going to finish up with Chief Fetterman. It's clear that drones will play

01:12:12a pivotal role in assisting disaster responses. What strategies have been used on the west coast

01:12:19to integrate drones into wildfire responses and how have they improved coordination between the

01:12:26federal, state and local responders? Well, certainly creating situational awareness

01:12:33integrates information flow between local, state and federal responders

01:12:38and certainly on incident management teams. So drones provide that increased situational

01:12:42awareness and they're a great tool to utilize on those kinds of events. Certainly airspace

01:12:48de-confliction is a priority to us. Drones and helicopters can't operate in the same space and

01:12:53time. So we're looking forward to additional AI technology that will allow that to better manage

01:13:01the airspace. Thank you so much and thank you all for being here today. I now recognize the gentle

01:13:09lady from Illinois, Ms. Ramirez, for her five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Chairs and

01:13:14Ranking Members. I'm not sure if the titles of these hearings are purposefully ironic or simply

01:13:23unfortunate coincidence for my Republican colleagues' boss. Unmanned is at the heart

01:13:30of President Musk's technologically driven future world vision and given his devotees in the room,

01:13:38it makes sense that we're not talking about the human casualties in Doja's mass firings,

01:13:42but the bots he wants to take their place. And don't get me wrong, I recognize that drones and

01:13:49other innovative technologies are critical tools to assist in disaster and emergency response,

01:13:55but I can't ignore the elephant in the room. Innovative technology should be assistive,

01:14:01supporting the work of emergency responders. Another place President Musk and I disagree is

01:14:07that bots assist humans, they don't replace them. People, both emergency responders and FEMA

01:14:14professionals, they're at the heart of our disaster response work across the country. But we know that

01:14:21President Musk doesn't believe people are at the heart of our disaster response work,

01:14:24he actually believes that machines can work better without the human messiness of debate, of oversight,

01:14:31of history, of reasoning, you know, some of the same building blocks that create democracy,

01:14:37I might point out. So it's deeply frustrating for me to see my colleagues go along with Musk's

01:14:43unmanned worldview, robbing first responders of the basic resources they need to do their jobs,

01:14:50dismantling FEMA, and also allowing DHS to withhold the funds that this House appropriated,

01:14:56which by the way is a violation of federal law, and a clear failure of the majority to provide

01:15:02appropriate oversight, the job that we have in this committee. But here we are. So I want to get

01:15:07into the questions. Chief Fetterman, yes or no, is it helpful to first responders like our

01:15:16firefighters when federal agencies like FEMA cannot provide grants for local cities, counties,

01:15:22and other communities to prepare for and attend to natural disasters? Yes or no?

01:15:30Congresswoman Ramirez, no it is not helpful. Thank you. And Chief Fetterman, I have another

01:15:34question for you, yes or no. Does it help firefighters when the federal government guts

01:15:39initiatives for research and new technologies that assist first responders in doing their

01:15:45jobs safer and more effectively? No it is not, ma'am. Thank you. Pivoting slightly, we know that some of

01:15:52these new technologies and bots that Elon loves so much have some bias and some privacy problems,

01:15:58just like him. In 2024, the Government Accountability Office, GAO, found drones can support law

01:16:05enforcement. However, the use of those technologies in public spaces where a warrant is not necessarily

01:16:12required prior to use, has led us with concerns about how law enforcement is ensuring that we're

01:16:17protecting civil rights, civil liberties, and privacy. Given that President Musk and Trump and

01:16:24his loyal follower, Nome, have gutted the Civil Rights and Civil Liberties, CRCL, division at DHS,

01:16:32which was tasked with preventing civil rights and liberty violations in the agency's work,

01:16:38I want to ask all of our witnesses here, how do your programs either offer capabilities or take

01:16:46steps to protect sensitive information acquired by the use of drones? And I'll start with Mr.

01:16:52Offerall. Yes, thank you. So I think when we develop these technologies, we definitely want

01:17:01to make sure that the information is safeguarded. I think moreover, one step that we're taking

01:17:06specifically at RASPIT is coordinating with the Ole Miss Law Program. So there's a drone and space

01:17:13law program. I had an opportunity to guest lecture last Tuesday. And one of the key initiatives that

01:17:19we were discussing was drone privacy, drone usage, admissibility in courts, as well as the safeguarding

01:17:26on that data. So one thing that we're really focused on is not only the enabling capability,

01:17:33the mitigating on the counter and the threat, but also how do you employ it in a way as best to

01:17:38protect civil liberties for those operators. Thank you. Mr. Furrow, I want to get to the

01:17:45rest of you. So you have like five or seven seconds, but Dr. Ledbetter. Yes, ma'am. Thank you.

01:17:52We, our army is our, the army is our customer. We're bound by their cyber security and data

01:17:57requirements and we're in compliance with them. Thank you, Mr. Hendricks. Yeah, no social

01:18:01location revealed and existing data. Once a determination is made, it wasn't planned for

01:18:06research to continue. I mean, for search and rescue to continue, it's eliminated. Thank you.

01:18:11And Chief Fetterman. The fire service goes to great lengths to protect private information.

01:18:16And, but our priority is life safety. We focus on life safety and saving lives and property.

01:18:22Thank you. And with that, I yield back. Thank you. The chair now recognizes the gentleman

01:18:28from North Carolina, Mr. Knott, for his five minutes of questioning. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:18:33Thank you to the witnesses who were here. I will say that I am a little bit miffed whenever I hear

01:18:38grievances about the current president and the funding that seems to be at issue. When you look

01:18:43at sanctuary cities, sanctuary states, and the amount of tax dollars that are going to illegal

01:18:49immigrants in states, just like Illinois, New York city, California, et cetera, where illegals,

01:18:55we now know, are getting free health care, free education, free transportation.

01:18:59These allocations in dollars far exceed the total budget of FEMA. So I find it a little bit

01:19:05disingenuous that we're railing on money that should otherwise be reappropriated or reallocated.

01:19:11Mr. Knott, would the gentleman yield? No, ma'am. And when we have had four years of draining

01:19:17billions and billions and billions of dollars to people who are not here illegally,

01:19:22the crocodile tears over FEMA not having enough money seems to be somewhat disingenuous.

01:19:28In regards to the issue at hand that we should be discussing, I would love to ask you,

01:19:35Mr. Hendricks, as a former federal prosecutor, drones are being used to a very effective extent

01:19:43to undermine law enforcement and truly our national security, whether it's the cartels,

01:19:48whether it's local transnational gangs, whether it's the Chinese Communist Party,

01:19:54whoever it may be, drones are a force multiplier. And one of my gravest frustrations, whether it was

01:19:59the Bureau of Prisons, whether it was federal law enforcement along the border,

01:20:04whether it was counter surveillance measures that were being executed, what are technologies that

01:20:10we can implement and we can provide or promote that would stop criminals from using drones so

01:20:17effectively? There are some technologies that allow us to establish white wall operations,

01:20:23so we'll eliminate aircraft from operating in the area. Of course, then the threat has evolved,

01:20:28so that now they're just flying aircraft on fiber optic cables, right? So it's hard to do that.

01:20:33Another thing I think is important from our standpoint is to look at what things we can do

01:20:38to enforce our capabilities so that they're not vulnerable to these technologies.

01:20:43Our counter UAS systems, for example, should be tested to certified threats by an independent

01:20:49agent based on the particular scenario that you're trying to protect. Okay, and can you explain just

01:20:54briefly how that would work in the field? How would that technology be best implemented? So the

01:21:00white wall technology, for example, is you identify your particular aircraft that's going to be

01:21:04operating. You could look at it as comparable to roughly comparable remote ID or to UAS traffic

01:21:11management. Identify those aircraft that are operating in the area than any other aircraft

01:21:15that's reported or detected by radars or certainly uncorrupted. Okay, thank you, sir. Yes, sir. Dr.

01:21:21Ledbetter, I want to talk to you in regards to the components that go into many drones that we use

01:21:26in a law enforcement capacity, in a first responder capacity. It's my understanding

01:21:30that many of those components are made in other countries, whether it's China, whether it's other

01:21:35nation states. Are you familiar with the basic percentage of our components that are put into

01:21:42American drones that are made in China or other countries? I'm not familiar with that number, sir.

01:21:48Are you familiar? Is it a problem that you're aware of? It is a problem, yes, sir. And how would

01:21:53you quantify, briefly, we've got a minute and a half, from your expertise, how can we assist

01:21:58bringing some of those jobs and technologies back to the United States for manufacturing?

01:22:02Well, it's absolutely critical. I find that most, whether it's first responders,

01:22:09military members, whatever, they want to get the job done and they'll get the job done. And right

01:22:13now, the cheapest, most available resource out there is going to be a DJI, which is Chinese

01:22:18product. And we need to comply with NDAA and bring those parts back into the United States

01:22:29and build a compliant American-made drone. Did I answer your question?

01:22:35It did, but in regards, I guess, to follow up, in regards to what we can do in this committee,

01:22:40are there certain regulations, rules, laws that make it more costly for drone manufacturers to

01:22:46operate or to produce their materials here as opposed to overseas that you're aware of?

01:22:50Absolutely. Supply chain is, you know, we're hamstrung by the supply chain to get parts.

01:22:56Availability is another issue. And then price. We're looking at anywhere from three to five

01:23:02times the cost per part to make an American-made drone versus a DJI or Chinese part.

01:23:09In regards to the technology, as you understand it, how are American companies,

01:23:13how are American innovators faring as it relates to international competitors?

01:23:18I don't really have that data. I know as far as we're concerned, it takes significantly more

01:23:25money, more resources, and more time to build a compliant drone versus a non-compliant drone.

01:23:31And one more question. When you say compliant drone, just so we understand,

01:23:34what are you referring to? NDAA compliance.

01:23:36Okay. Thank you, sir. Mr. Chairman, I yield back.

01:23:40Thank you. In closing, I would like to thank all of our witnesses for their valuable testimony.

01:23:47I would like to thank Chairman Strong, Ranking Member Correa, Ranking Member Kennedy,

01:23:53and all of the members for their participation in today's hearing.

01:23:57The members of the subcommittees may have additional questions for the witnesses.

01:24:02And we would ask the witnesses to respond to these questions in writing.

01:24:08Pursuant to Committee Rule 7e, the hearing record will be held open for 10 days.

01:24:14Without objection, the subcommittees stand adjourned.

House Homeland Security Committee Holds Hearing About DHS Using Drones

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