A growing regional campaign is calling on Malaysia to take a leadership role in the upcoming International Labour Conference in Geneva this June. They’re urging Prime Minister Anwar Ibrahim to support unprecedented measures under Article 33 of the International Labour Organization’s Constitution—the most serious sanction the ILO can impose—in response to Myanmar’s military junta’s continued violation of workers’ rights and violent suppression of democracy. On this episode of #ConsiderThis Melisa Idris speaks with Charles Santiago, Co-Chair of the ASEAN Parliamentarians for Human Rights (APHR).
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00:00Hi, welcome back to Consider This. I'm Melissa Idris. In an open letter to the Prime Minister,
00:25a global union federation is urging Malaysia to support an ILO Article 33 sanction. This is rarely
00:34used but a powerful tool, this ahead of the International Labour Conference in June.
00:40The sanction is to be against the Myanmar junta for violations of workers' rights and a violation
00:46of democracy. Joining me now to speak about this further is Charles Santiago, who was cc'd in the
00:53open letter. He's the co-chair of the ASEAN Parliamentarians for Human Rights. Charles,
01:00thank you so much for being on the show with me. I appreciate your time. You were cc'd in this
01:03open letter to the Prime Minister calling for Article 33 measures against Myanmar. Can we talk
01:10a little bit about that? What is the letter's call to action? What is your response to it? And do you
01:17think Malaysia is in a position to send a message? Thanks Melissa for having me to discuss important
01:25regional development. And let me just quickly respond to the question that you had involving
01:30Article 33. Now Article 33 has got many components to it, but I think we need to focus on two areas
01:39which I think will go a long way in trying to bring some kind of a normalcy and a process of democracy
01:48and development in Myanmar. I think one of the things, the first things the government has to do are the
01:55requirements of the ILO Article 33 is the release of political prisoners. Now this is something that the
02:03Malaysian Prime Minister Dasri Anwar Ibrahim has also called for. And in his recent visit to Bangkok,
02:12he also made the call again. And he was quite encouraged by the release of at least, I think one
02:19or two hundred people. But I think what is important is to create a sense of confidence on the
02:26five-point consensus and Malaysia's leadership. I think what Myanmar has to do is to release more
02:34political prisoners who have been put in jail without any legal necessity. They've been just arrested and put
02:49in jail without legal recourse. So this is something that has to be looked at. And I think Malaysia is the
02:56chair, can follow up, although it's an article 33 of the ILO. But it is also something that you find in
03:03the five-point consensus on political dialogue of the ASEAN heads of government. Now the second is the issue of
03:10jet fuel. The issue of jet fuel is a very serious development and there has been an international call all over the
03:18world. And where some governments have also supported the call. And this is to stop sending jet fuel into
03:25Myanmar. And that is because the junta is using the jet fuel together with arms it's procuring from
03:36elsewhere to bomb hospitals, villages and schools and to create a fear and environment of fear
03:47danger and anxiety within the population. So one of the and I think this is something that Malaysia as
03:55the chair of ASEAN and also a member of the ILO can actually push for both at the meeting next month at
04:03the ILO conference in Geneva at the same time at the meeting that is taking place at the end of this
04:09month in Malaysia where the heads of government from ASEAN will be here together with Malaysian partners. So I think
04:15this is that Malaysia's leadership at both levels both at ASEAN as well as ILO will be something that
04:22people will be looking forward to. Charles, Myanmar is still recovering from that devastating earthquake
04:29that happened at the end of February, early April if I'm not mistaken. Can we talk a little bit about that?
04:38If there are economic sanctions placed on the military junta, will this cripple the need for
04:45the rebuilding of Myanmar and the distribution of humanitarian aid? Sure. I think there are two
04:53separate issues. I think it is not a blanket sanctions across the board. It doesn't involve food,
05:03it doesn't involve medicine, it doesn't involve economic activity. What it only requires is one,
05:09jet fuel. The sanctions against jet fuel and number two, against arms that are being brought into the
05:16country and that is sold by countries like Russia, China and to some extent Eastern Europe including
05:22India as well. So these are countries that are supporting the junta and that is why there's a global
05:28call by agencies, non-governmental organizations and countries that want some kind of democracy in
05:35Myanmar not to bring in jet fuel. That is a sanction. Now coming back to the issue of humanitarian aid,
05:42this is something that is very devastating and that is because the very jet fuel and the very bombs that
05:50are being brought into the country is being used to bomb the very places that have been devastated by the
05:57earthquake. This is done by the junta and the Malaysian prime minister has called for a ceasefire
06:05and I think that's very welcome and I think that but unfortunately there is nobody monitoring the ceasefire.
06:14This is important because while the earthquake is happening in places like Mandalay, places like
06:20Sagayang and so on and including Nepido, the bombs are still raining, the bombs are still coming down
06:27against the ethnic groups and so on. So the call by the prime minister is not being listened or being
06:33there's no response effective response from the junta in Myanmar. Despite the meeting, despite the meeting
06:41that took place between the prime minister of Malaysia as well as Min Ong Lai, General Min Ong Lai,
06:47who agreed to extend the ceasefire but two days after that the bombs were again going and I think
06:55there's almost about, some people have documented it, about 165 bombs have been put in and these are
07:02not small bombs, they are 500 pound bombs which are thrown at hospitals though. There are bomb used to bomb
07:08hospitals, villages and places of worship. Now I say this because I was at the border last week and I heard from
07:16people who are actually fleeing from those areas into the borders of Myanmar and Thailand. So it's a first-hand
07:24account and the result of the bombing and this first, that's number one. Number two, whatever
07:32international aid that the government is getting, the Myanmar junta is getting, I shouldn't say government
07:38because it was the government is an overthrow. Lots of services, lots of money and lots of resources are
07:49being diverted to Naypyidaw. Naypyidaw is where the capital of Myanmar is located and that is run by the military junta.
08:02So some of the buildings have been broken and quite badly and it's crushed down. So now a lot of these resources
08:09are being diverted there. So therefore, our Malaysia has a responsibility to respond to these issues in the context of
08:17the five-point consensus that Malaysia, Malaysia agreed to and Indonesia agreed to and all the other countries,
08:23including Myanmar. Mingong Lai was at the meeting and he agreed to the five-point consensus. It's four years,
08:30going on to the fifth, nothing has happened. Nothing has happened and this lack of progress makes many
08:35people wonder whether the five-point consensus is actually, should be the driving force of the way
08:41forward. Can I ask you, you pointed out to the fact that Malaysia is ASEAN chair, we've got the ASEAN
08:45summit at the end of the month and we've got the ILO conference coming up in June. When is there an
08:51approach that Malaysia can take to the Myanmar crisis that might shift the needle in terms of progress
09:01and maybe do things differently? What can it do that others cannot? And what happens to Malaysia's
09:09credibility if ASEAN continues to not make progress on the five-point consensus? What's at stake for the
09:16region? I think there are two or three sets of issues that we can discuss. One is the outflow of
09:26refugees that is happening as a result of the bombings. That's number one. Number two, there is
09:34also an effort by the government, the ruling junta to conscript young boys, youths into the army. So all of
09:42this is pushing everywhere and the bombings and so on, pushing people to the border. And they are now
09:49becoming refugees in the border between Myanmar and Thailand. And these refugees are moving into
09:57Bangkok, into Thailand, as well as into Malaysia. So this is a long story, but just to cut it short,
10:05what is happening is the Myanmar problem has become an ASEAN problem. And don't forget, we also have the
10:15movement of drugs along with this, possibly the movement of arms and also the scam centers that are
10:23emerging in the border areas, which involves Malaysians working there and traffic Malaysians working there,
10:32as well as from other countries of the world. That's number one. Number two, the dire need at this time
10:38and that requires Malaysians leadership is actually the humanitarian support.
10:46Now, just to give some context to this, there are almost about a million over people along the border,
10:52along the border and the border is spread is quite long. You have the Thai border together with Myanmar,
10:57there are the Chinese border and then the Indian border. So all of these borders, people are running
11:02away to get some kind of protection, some kind of asylum from these bombs and so on and so forth.
11:09Now, most of them are being supported by European Union and other governments, including at one time
11:17USAID. Now USAID has been cut. USAID has been cut and that actually set a devastating blow
11:25to the existing non-governmental organizations that are providing services like food, like healthcare,
11:32like education to the refugee population. And I think this has to be addressed. So therefore,
11:38there is a need for Malaysia to float the idea of an ASEAN humanitarian fund. An ASEAN humanitarian fund,
11:47which can be used to support the people on the border and number two, and also support the refugees
11:56who are coming into Thailand and also to Malaysia. The number of people coming into Malaysia as a result
12:03of what's happening in Myanmar is quite high. So we need to some kind of a proactive approach and also
12:10finances because the USAID, which is a huge amounts of money, has been cut. So therefore,
12:14there's something that we really have to keep in mind.
12:17You're going to say something?
12:19No, no. All right. We'll continue to wrap up. We've got about a minute or so left. Is there
12:24anything else you want to add?
12:25No, but I must comment. To a conclusion, I must comment that Malaysia is making lots of effort,
12:32the great effort, and the leadership of the Prime Minister has to be recognized here. Compared to all
12:38the other heads of government, this is the first head of state that actually met, although through Zoom,
12:45the resistance groups. Although there are lots of meetings happening below the radar,
12:50but this is the first time there was an open acknowledgement of the head of the National
12:55Union, National Unity Government of Myanmar. So this is actually something very good. In my view,
13:01I think it's a game changer. But you can't stop there. You have to move forward.
13:06Charles, thank you so much for speaking with us today. Charles Santiago, co-chair of the ASEAN
13:11Parliamentarians for Human Rights there. Wrapping up this episode of Consider This.
13:15I'm Melissa Igles, signing off for the evening. Thank you so much for watching. Good night.
13:29Oh my God.
13:43Good night.
13:50You