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00:00:00For the love of the horse, for generations to come.
00:00:28Welcome to another edition of the TDN Writer's Room.
00:00:30My name is Bill Finley.
00:00:31I'm a correspondent for the Thoroughbred Daily News and a fan of the hottest team in baseball,
00:00:37the Boston Red Sox.
00:00:38You knew that was going to slide in there somewhere.
00:00:41I'm Randy Moss with NBC Sports and the Buyer Speed Figure team.
00:00:46TD Thornton speaking to you from a little bit north of Boston today and I am a stablemate
00:00:51of Bill's at Thoroughbred Daily News.
00:00:53Yeah, well lots going on this week, especially with Saratoga getting ready to run, but let's
00:00:58take a look back at some of the more interesting races from last weekend and there was a ton.
00:01:02I picked out three that I wanted to talk about and Randy, we kid you of having so many favorite
00:01:07horses.
00:01:08Well, I'm going to, I have, everyone knows Bookham Dano's number one, but I have a number
00:01:12two.
00:01:13So I have two favorite horses.
00:01:14That's next.
00:01:15And I think he's such a cool story.
00:01:18He went off and did what he always does in the Brooklyn at a mile and three-eighths.
00:01:22He won by the length of the stretch.
00:01:24In his last five starts, he's been first by a combined margin of 56 and three-quarter
00:01:31lengths.
00:01:32Likely the Birdstone Stakes at San, excuse me, of course not at Santa Anita, at Saratoga
00:01:36is next.
00:01:37But I bring up the same subject I brought up before, please try this horse in the Jockey
00:01:41Club Gold Cup or against more conventional horses.
00:01:43I mean the horse only made $110,000 winning the Brooklyn.
00:01:48You would win that finishing, you would make that much money finishing third in the Jockey
00:01:51Club Gold Cup.
00:01:54All right.
00:01:55Well, I have a difference of opinion here.
00:01:57I wouldn't do it.
00:01:58I would do exactly like Doug Cowens is doing and exactly like owner Michael Foster is doing
00:02:04because to me the past performances of next are just cut and dried.
00:02:10I mean, it tells you what he wants to do.
00:02:15Leading into the Cape Henlupin, I don't know if that's how you pronounce it or not, race
00:02:19at Delaware Park in September of 2022 when Cowens first decided to stretch the horse
00:02:25out to a mile and a half.
00:02:28Going into that race, next had won only two of his previous 10 starts.
00:02:35Since then, since they stretched him out, which has enabled him to sort of go at his
00:02:40own kind of loping pace early and not be pressed and can be up there close to the pace and
00:02:46not drop too far behind.
00:02:48It turned out to be just the perfect scenario for next.
00:02:53And since then, he's won seven of his eight starts at either a mile and a half or a mile
00:03:00and three quarters or a mile and three eighths by an average winning margin of 12 lengths.
00:03:07He's been a completely different horse since they stretched him out to what we would call
00:03:11marathon distances in America.
00:03:14And I mean, I get it why people want to see something else from next.
00:03:24But to me, I feel like Doug Cowens does.
00:03:27I mean, let's enjoy what this horse does.
00:03:29There's not a dirt horse in the world who can outrun this horse at a mile and a half
00:03:36or thereabouts.
00:03:38And that's his specialty.
00:03:39And I see no reason to try to force him to do something that he's shown that he doesn't
00:03:44really want to do.
00:03:45All right.
00:03:46Let me throw one more thought at you.
00:03:48And I know exactly where you're coming from.
00:03:51But how about trying him in a mile and a half grass race?
00:03:55Might that be the Breeders' Cup turf?
00:03:59I believe he's run on the turf in the past.
00:04:01I'm not sure.
00:04:02I'd have to look that up.
00:04:03But I would just like to see them experiment.
00:04:05Give them one shot at doing something a little bit outside the box.
00:04:08It doesn't work.
00:04:09You go back and you win these long distance races.
00:04:13But he would get that same sort of pace scenario in, say, like the turf classic that he seems
00:04:19to like so much.
00:04:20Or if I owned him, I'd run him in the Sword Dancer next.
00:04:24That would be my spot.
00:04:25Yeah.
00:04:26That's not beyond the realm.
00:04:28Yeah.
00:04:29And from a buyer speed figure perspective, Randy, this must be some sort of a record
00:04:33here.
00:04:34He's had seven races at a mile and three eighths or longer, and he's cracked triple digits
00:04:37every single one.
00:04:40I was entertained just looking back through past performances, and I wasn't initially
00:04:45aware that he started out for trainer Wesley Ward, who is a crackerjack trainer getting
00:04:50horses to win sprint distances early.
00:04:53He was a beaten favorite first time out going four and a half furlongs at Woodbine.
00:04:58And he even ran in the 2020 Breeders' Cup Juvenile.
00:05:01He finished last.
00:05:02He didn't beat a horse.
00:05:04But I believe he's still the only horse out of that race still competing.
00:05:08And they claimed him from Wesley Ward and Silverton Hill for $62,500.
00:05:13And he ran for $50,000 claiming for these connections, just two races, or his very next
00:05:17start actually, which he won on the turf, as Bill mentioned, he won on the turf at a
00:05:23mile and an eighth.
00:05:24But I mean, this is just a remarkable horse, and it's amazing to see him do what he's doing.
00:05:29Yeah.
00:05:30It's a really cool story, and I'm not going to poo-poo anything that he's accomplished
00:05:34because Source is doing things that are very special.
00:05:38And we'll keep watching him in these marathon events.
00:05:41I guess the Birdstone is, I think that's a mile and seven eighths or something like that,
00:05:45that race?
00:05:46Yeah.
00:05:47You know what's really, truly amazing about this horse is that all of us who have cut
00:05:52our teeth on dirt racing throughout the years, we know that when you get in a two-turn race,
00:05:58even at the very top level stakes race, right, if you're going a mile and a sixteenth, a
00:06:02mile and an eighth, it's great at a mile and a quarter.
00:06:06If you can finish the last quarter mile in 24 seconds, right, 24 and change is a super
00:06:12fast closing fraction on dirt for top, top horses going long.
00:06:18Next just ran a mile and three eighths in the Brooklyn.
00:06:22He ran his penultimate, his next to last furlong in 11.88.
00:06:28He ran his final furlong in 11.89.
00:06:32He came home in 23.77 seconds at a mile and three eighths, and then he galloped out like
00:06:39a fiend when he crossed the wire.
00:06:41If he'd gone a mile and a half, he probably would have gone in 224 and change, right?
00:06:46I mean, it's unbelievable what this horse has done since they've stretched him out.
00:06:50Yeah, great story.
00:06:52So let's go out to Southern California where they had a great lady M stakes on Saturday
00:06:56at Los Alamitos.
00:06:58And I wanted to bring this up because this is a horse that's certainly has flown under
00:07:01the radar, but maybe not anymore.
00:07:03Sweet Azteca two starts ago beat a Dare Manor in the Beholder, the grade one, but still
00:07:08all the talk was about Dare Manor and idiomatic and whatnot.
00:07:13Trainer Michael McCarthy switched her back to six and a half furlong race at Los Alamitos.
00:07:18She wins by five and 114.33 for six and a half furlongs, sets a track record.
00:07:25She's got to be talked about, I think, in the same breath right now with the very best
00:07:29mayors in her division, Randy.
00:07:31Oh, yeah.
00:07:32I mean, a Dare Manor is obviously one of the very best in her division.
00:07:36After a Sweet Azteca beat her in the Beholder miles, Dare Manor went on to win the Apple
00:07:41Blossom at Oklahoma Park.
00:07:42I know for getting, you know, getting ready for NBC's coverage on Kentucky Derby Week,
00:07:48they were initially wanting to bring Sweet Azteca to Churchill Downs to run on in one
00:07:54of the undercard stakes, but she had a little minor setback and so she didn't make it.
00:08:00But I mean, this was, you know, again, a step forward for Sweet Azteca, a 106 buyer speed
00:08:05figure.
00:08:06I mean, she looked absolutely dominant.
00:08:08I still don't know if she's going to be better than a Dare Manor, let's say, or idiomatic,
00:08:20you know, going like a mile and an eighth on dirt in the Breeders' Cup Distaff.
00:08:25The Breeders' Cup filly and mayor sprint, I think, might wind up being a better spot,
00:08:31but hey, I mean, she just, you know, she's run a mile and beat a Dare Manor and she's
00:08:35obviously in top form.
00:08:38Connections have said they'll nominate her practically everywhere and one of the likely
00:08:42landing spots, though, could be the grade one ballerina at Saratoga.
00:08:46That's a seven-eighths race on the 24th of August or 24th of, yes, August.
00:08:53Another race that caught my attention over the weekend, and for the wrong reasons, is
00:08:56the Dwyer stakes at Belmont.
00:08:58And I've been saying for some time now that Naira needs to get rid of some stakes races.
00:09:03This race this year attracted a four-horse field, won by domestic product, paid $340.
00:09:08Last year, Fort Bragg, six-horse field, $340.
00:09:12The year before that, charge it, six-horse field, $320, 2021, five-horse field, $280,
00:09:19not run in 2020 because of COVID, and 2019, six-horse field, $430.
00:09:24Naira has a couple of races like this that just basically don't serve any purpose anymore.
00:09:29I mean, if you got rid of the Dwyer, nobody would miss it.
00:09:33Take that money, spread it around overnight or add it to extra stakes money, and, you
00:09:39know, it's not, they shouldn't want to be put themselves in a situation where they're
00:09:45likely going to get four or five horses for one of these races.
00:09:49And I know they're kind of out of the way racetracks, but one of the problems was on
00:09:52that weekend, that same day, Prairie Meadows had their Iowa Derby and Canterbury had their
00:09:57Minnesota Derby.
00:09:58So there was three derbies, all, none of them were for, are going to attract the triple
00:10:03crown type horses.
00:10:04They're all going to attract the second string horses.
00:10:07And that's exactly what happened.
00:10:08I think that it would make so much sense that, you know, I'm not talking about getting rid
00:10:12of 20 races, but there are four or five races on the Naira calendar that have just become
00:10:17obsolete.
00:10:18And I just think it's time to put the Brookline, the Dwyer, I know the Dwyer has probably been
00:10:22run for 120 years or something, but it's time has come and gone, put it out of its misery.
00:10:27Well, I, you know, you can start with the Dwyer and then you're going to have to start
00:10:30looking at other four and five and six-horse stakes races.
00:10:35I don't think the problem is limited to just the Dwyer.
00:10:38It's, you know, it's, it's, and it's not limited to just Naira.
00:10:43And talking about the Dwyer itself and what we saw in the Dwyer from domestic product,
00:10:49it was a remarkable win, a very, very eye-catching win for this horse who was basically, you
00:10:56know, side-by-side with Hades, who's a decent horse at the top of the stretch.
00:11:00And then with a very impressive stride, domestic product just left him behind, nice, nice turn
00:11:06of foot.
00:11:07The temptation would be, I think anybody that watches this, it was a one mile, one turn,
00:11:12you'd say, okay, this is a Travers horse.
00:11:15But when they've run domestic product at longer distances in the past, what you see if you
00:11:20go back and watch is a horse that, that gets overanxious, that pulls with the rider, that,
00:11:26that, you know, the slower paces of the distance races make him a little impatient.
00:11:33And so that's why Chad Brown decided that he wanted to cut him back in distance to one
00:11:38turn.
00:11:39So instead of looking ahead to longer races, he's got Sierra Leone and others all ready
00:11:43for the Travers, but the Allen Jerkins is now going to be the next target for domestic
00:11:48product.
00:11:49And boy, it looks like he's definitely lined up to be one of the favorites for that.
00:11:53Book him, Dano's going in that race.
00:11:58The TDN Riders Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:12:00The September sale runs from September 9th to the 21st, and the team at Keeneland is
00:12:04preparing for the September sale, and it's no easy task.
00:12:07They will inspect over 2,900 yearlings, travel over 5,000 miles, and visit 338 farms.
00:12:14This weekend alone, the Keeneland September sale produced three graded stakes winners,
00:12:18Mulliken, Warlight Goddess, and Honored D. Lady, the winner of the Del Park Handicap.
00:12:21We'll be right back after this message from Keeneland.
00:12:26At Keeneland, a horse will always be measured in hands.
00:12:33Hands that see, that sense, that speak.
00:12:42Hands that hold our sport to a higher standard, not for our sake, but for theirs.
00:12:50For the love of the horse for generations to come.
00:12:56The fastest horse of the week is brought to you this week by Nashville.
00:13:00One of the fastest of the many fast sires at Windstar Farm.
00:13:04After all, in Nashville's career debut, he ran six and a half furlongs and won 14.48
00:13:09and became a TDN Rising Star.
00:13:12He followed that up with the fastest six furlongs of that Keeneland fall meet, 109.10, to win
00:13:17an allowance by almost 10 lengths.
00:13:19He topped that by setting the six furlong track record at Keeneland, 107.89 on the Breeders'
00:13:24Cup undercard, faster than the Breeders' Cup sprint later that same day, by the way.
00:13:29And at the fairgrounds, Nashville ran the fastest six furlongs of the 21-22 winter meet, 108.61 seconds.
00:13:38That means Nashville is pretty fast.
00:13:41And he was pretty fast in the breeding shed too, where he has been so far.
00:13:44He bred 204 mares in his first book.
00:13:4791% of those mares getting into fall.
00:13:50Nashville's first weanlings will sell this fall.
00:13:54So while Nashville specialized in blazing sprint speed, our fastest horse of the week
00:13:59specializes in what we in America would call marathon distances.
00:14:03We've already talked about him.
00:14:04His name is Next.
00:14:05And in that Brooklyn Stakes win, buyer speed figure, career high, 109.
00:14:12A well-deserved fastest horse of the week.
00:14:14Nod to Next.
00:14:21The TD and Writer's Room has long been affiliated with the Green Group, the sponsor of this weekly segment.
00:14:26The Green Group is an accounting, tax consulting and advisory firm that has a fondness for and a special expertise in helping those in the thoroughbred industry.
00:14:37And now the Green Group Guest of the Week.
00:14:40Welcome in now the Green Group Guest of the Week.
00:14:42And who else do we have on right before Saratoga, but the CEO and president of the New York Racing Association, Dave O'Rourke.
00:14:49Dave, thanks so much for spending some time with us.
00:14:51And it looks like you've already got a little smile on your face.
00:14:54You've got a couple of days to go before opening day.
00:14:56And it looks like everybody's pretty excited about what we hope will be a great meet.
00:15:00Yeah, no, actually having the Bellman up here.
00:15:02So it's actually a Tacoma week than usual.
00:15:05Setting up a place ready to go.
00:15:09It looks like it might get a little bit of rain on Thursday, but the weekend's looking clear so far.
00:15:13Dave, one of the big stories and perhaps the biggest story of the meet last year were the breakdowns.
00:15:18And, you know, nobody's pointing any fingers at Naira.
00:15:21We know how hard you guys try to keep the horses safe.
00:15:24But could you go through in 2024 what's in place?
00:15:28What can you guys do to make sure?
00:15:30I'm not going to say you're going to get a zero, but make sure you have as few fatalities as possible.
00:15:36Well, you know, last year, and you got to remember how rare these are.
00:15:40Specifically, the ones on the dirt last year, like that was statistically such an anomaly.
00:15:46But a high octane sport, you have to like safety has to be number one.
00:15:52So in terms of the tracks, the tracks have just been tested.
00:15:55Actually, McPeterson was just out here.
00:15:57They all look good.
00:15:58The feedback's been very good.
00:16:00The weather coming into this meet is not nearly as wet, for lack of a better term, as last year.
00:16:07And, you know, the hyzer protocols, they've been refined.
00:16:10There's been some changes on the specifically injectables, for one, in terms of timelines coming into this meet.
00:16:17And I think you're seeing that.
00:16:19And you're seeing that from the industry as a whole rolling into it through the triple crown.
00:16:23I think you're really starting to see the effects of having a unified structure here for safety.
00:16:31But before we move on, one more question on that topic.
00:16:37In the recent news blurb about NYRA trying to standardize the dirt racing surfaces across all three of your racetracks,
00:16:48I noticed in the news article the statistic about the safety rate of Saratoga and Oklahoma
00:16:58and how low it was compared to the average nationally and compared even to, like, Belmont Park.
00:17:06How encouraging is that?
00:17:08It is.
00:17:09And in our circuit, those have been, you know, over the recent history, the safest tracks that we have on here.
00:17:16They're specific in that they have a clay pad over the base.
00:17:20Belmont was a clay track, and the outer, the original outer main track at Aqueduct were built that way.
00:17:26So the summer and spring tracks, like, traditionally were built that way.
00:17:29They kind of have a little bit more bounce.
00:17:31They're easier to keep the moisture levels consistent.
00:17:34And that's what we intend to put in at Belmont.
00:17:37And, you know, as part of that, that does relate into running on the all-weather in the winter because you can't put salt in a track like that.
00:17:44Yeah, so there are limitations.
00:17:46There's really good.
00:17:47And then the downside would be you can't use it in every condition.
00:17:50So we're trying to get the best surfaces for the conditions that would be present during when we're running on.
00:17:56Dave, with the announcement that as of 2026, the winter racing portion of the season at Nairu will be moving over to an all-tapita surface,
00:18:06I don't think there was any resistance from the horsemen from having a tapita surface.
00:18:13But there seemed to be a little pushback.
00:18:15Not everybody was quite on board with it being the only surface in the winter.
00:18:19Can you just give us an overview of why a dirt track and a tapita surface can't coexist in the winter?
00:18:25Well, it depends if you want the best of both worlds.
00:18:27And that's what we want in terms of safety on the surface.
00:18:31You can't have a clay base or a clay pad over the base and put salt in the track.
00:18:36So you're not going to be able to use that track during freezing conditions in the winter.
00:18:40If you look at the all-weather surfaces, it's essentially designed for winter use and for inclement weather.
00:18:47So if you're trying to apply the tech of today, I mean, the tech in the 70s was a dirt track with a limestone base,
00:18:56and they actually built a second one at Aqueduct to do that.
00:18:58And roughly 50 years later, we're approaching this and we're using the best materials that are available.
00:19:05Tapita has been around for a long time.
00:19:07It's tried and tested at this point.
00:19:10And it's change. It is change.
00:19:13And, you know, we are getting feedback on it, but there's just no way for us to have the best of both worlds to run through the winter.
00:19:22And with our sport, high-octane sport, as mentioned earlier, safety is number one.
00:19:27We're going to put down the tracks that we feel give us the best opportunity to have a safe event.
00:19:34Dave, if you had a Tapita track at Saratoga last year, you would have obviously had better handle because so many of the races got washed off the turf.
00:19:41You had 65 races came off the turf last year.
00:19:44As we've seen at Gulfstream, when these races come off the turf, they move them to Tapita.
00:19:48They lose very few horses, and it's a better product for the betters and better for the racetrack.
00:19:53I can't imagine where you would put it or how you would do it, but is there any chance you could shoehorn a Tapita track in at Saratoga?
00:20:01We are looking at engineering to see what it would look like.
00:20:06I haven't seen that exactly, but you would think it would be on the inside, obviously, like a 75 track.
00:20:11You'd widen the actual outer turf course.
00:20:13But then you might be limiting your turf program, but in other ways, you might be extending it because you can come off it and you're not going up the turf in foul weather.
00:20:23That's in discussion. It's very early on.
00:20:27That's a big change for up here.
00:20:29It would have to be done right, obviously.
00:20:32We don't have tunnels. Tunnels would be a little bit of a challenge because of the water table.
00:20:36But, yeah, that is a conversation, Bill, to answer your question.
00:20:39Because in terms of, you know, we were talking about the winter, but the off-the-turf aspect of the Tapita is obviously another huge bonus.
00:20:47I don't see us carting the three surfaces in tandem at any point, at least not right now.
00:20:52That's not in any of our plans.
00:20:55So, Dave, as you look ahead now to this Saratoga meet and you sit down in your office with your spreadsheets and you try to project exactly what the business is going to be like,
00:21:04how encouraging was it, the reception that you got from that special Belmont Steaks meeting at Saratoga?
00:21:11It was amazing, actually.
00:21:13It was incredible.
00:21:16You know, in terms of that really sets up some momentum rolling into the meet.
00:21:22At the core of this, it's an entertainment product, and the fans up here are so bought in.
00:21:29We're looking for amazing crowds, television.
00:21:34There's just so many aspects to this in terms of really throwing a party for 40 days when you get down to it.
00:21:41Everyone has so much fun up here.
00:21:43We just hope it stays dry.
00:21:44I mean, that's always the challenge with Saratoga is the one thing you can't control is the weather.
00:21:49Dave, that mini meet at Saratoga, so to speak, the Belmont Steaks Festival, it was a necessity this year and next year because of the reconstruction that's going on at Belmont Park.
00:22:04And by most accounts, it was a rousing success.
00:22:08Even though it was a necessity because of the construction, it also, in a way, might have been a little bit of a trial balloon for what happens post-2026 when eventually Belmont Park, the new one, and Saratoga are going to be the only venues left in Naira's stable.
00:22:24I know in the past you've been reluctant to answer this question when we put it to you, but we're going to ask you again.
00:22:29What is the post-2026 Naira schedule going to look like now that you've seen what a mini meet at Saratoga can do?
00:22:35Should we expect roughly 10 months at Belmont and the same 40 days at Saratoga, or would there be a possibility for another mini meet or festival?
00:22:43I mean, it's always in discussion because there is interest in that.
00:22:47Even some board members have brought that up.
00:22:49But at the moment, it's 10 and 2, like you said.
00:22:53There's nothing definitive, but that is something that is discussed.
00:22:56I mean, you can't deny there is an attraction to it.
00:22:59Even running the 4th of July downstate, you sort of feel like some people are waiting out to go to Saratoga.
00:23:05So does it make sense?
00:23:07So this is an ongoing discussion.
00:23:09But at the moment, the way we've mapped it out or forecasted, nothing's changing.
00:23:13And anything that does change, there's going to be a lot of dialogue before.
00:23:17So it's not going to be a surprise, that's for sure.
00:23:20So when you guys talk about mini meets, right?
00:23:22I mean, I know one of the reasons that are more than just this, but one of the benefits of the remodeling of Belmont Park is that you could have the Breeders' Cup back at Belmont Park for the first time in a long time.
00:23:35Saratoga is not that far north of Elmont, New York.
00:23:40I mean, could it be possible that a mini meet in the future might include a Breeders' Cup at Saratoga?
00:23:46It's worth a conversation.
00:23:49I'd have to look at the historical weather record on that one.
00:23:52Because there's a difference between Queens and upstate here, specifically that time of year.
00:23:59Would it be interesting?
00:24:00Of course.
00:24:01Do I think in terms of the weather risk?
00:24:04It's probably a long shot.
00:24:06That question, by the way, was asked by somebody who lives in Minnesota who gets psyched.
00:24:12So that's Randy's perspective.
00:24:16And there will not be a Breeders' Cup at Canterbury Park, I guarantee.
00:24:20Dave, I think one of the things that has made Saratoga so special, and I'm going to link this to Fenway Park.
00:24:29I'm a huge Red Sox fan.
00:24:30I go up there.
00:24:31Both the Boston Red Sox and, in the same respects, Naira, you've been able to keep the tradition and the history.
00:24:38And going back to the 1800s for you guys, and Fenway Park goes back to 1912.
00:24:43But at the same time, bringing in modern amenities and making it, even though it's a track that's been around for more than 100 years, seem modern.
00:24:51Has that been a difficult balancing act?
00:24:54The last five, six years or so, you take your time.
00:24:58Specifically, you walk the plant.
00:25:01You look at where the activity is.
00:25:03You look at things that could be refreshed.
00:25:05Then you talk to the architects and the historical society up here and how you might approach that.
00:25:10Since 1863, I know what you've seen up here is small evolution in spots.
00:25:17This is a jewel.
00:25:20Even going back to the Tepita, would you put one in here?
00:25:24Anything that you do to touch this place needs to be so well thought out, communicated, and you want the feedback.
00:25:31I think the Jim Dandy bar came out really cool.
00:25:34I think people are going to enjoy that this summer.
00:25:36It looks good.
00:25:37We changed the orientation, like really on the first floor of the clubhouse.
00:25:42The paddock suite or the treehouse would be the other one.
00:25:44That one looks like it could have been here for 50, 60 years already.
00:25:48So there's a few more things we'd like to do, but we're just taking our time.
00:25:52You have to really think it through.
00:25:58Dave, shifting back downstate to Belmont,
00:26:00please bring us up to date on what's been completed so far, what are the next major phases,
00:26:05and are you still on target to host the 2026 Belmont Stakes there?
00:26:10Still on target.
00:26:11The building's almost down, so we haven't really gotten into the construction.
00:26:15Obviously, ordering the materials and procurement, but the building's coming down.
00:26:19The track work's really been what's been progressing in terms of seeing finished products start to come together.
00:26:26Now, you're not seeing a turf course yet, but the amount of infrastructure that's going in with drainage, dry wells, irrigation systems,
00:26:35it's phenomenal what's going on there in terms of the size of the infrastructure with the tunnels and the infield.
00:26:42It's really cool.
00:26:43I mean, that's something that's probably worth a story on its own, because not very often do you get to see.
00:26:47One is essentially the largest track in the states, right, and that's being built from the ground up,
00:26:53and we're adding a new tapita track.
00:26:55So to really just see the infrastructure lay down and what goes into services, modern services today, it's cool.
00:27:03And I give all the credit to Glenn Kozak.
00:27:06We just got to pull them out of there now and bring them up north for a few months.
00:27:10So you mentioned that Saratoga is like a 40-day party.
00:27:15I know it's worth it, but how exhausting is it for you and for the people that are in the management at Saratoga
00:27:22that, you know, have to go through that every single day at the end of the meet?
00:27:26Are you just like completely wiped?
00:27:28It was easier when I was younger.
00:27:32Yeah, it is.
00:27:33It's a rough haul.
00:27:34I mean, we're five days now, not six.
00:27:37That was a big change to actually get a day off in that sense for the crew here.
00:27:43But, yeah, it's – listen, here in Niagara, we don't stop.
00:27:46I mean, we're running all year round.
00:27:48There really isn't a break.
00:27:50And, you know, folks that come in here from other places, like it's – you got to get your wind.
00:27:56It's not – it's a very long year.
00:27:59So, yeah, this is the highlight of it, though.
00:28:01This is the most fun, really, when you get down to it.
00:28:03Actually, from the Belmont – this whole, like, summer season, once you start with the Belmont
00:28:07and then the Triple Crown coming through Labor Day, it's the high point.
00:28:10If you're not having fun now, you don't belong at all.
00:28:14Dave, knocking Saratoga is kind of like knocking Santa Claus,
00:28:17but Chad Brown did it nonetheless in an interview he gave to the Horse Racing Nation website.
00:28:23And his argument was that there are just too many cheap races.
00:28:27A guy like him with the better horses is not even going to be competing in at least half the races in there.
00:28:33You know, there was a day and age when, you know, we didn't see $20,000 claimers at Saratoga,
00:28:38but I understand you've had to expand the meet.
00:28:40But, A, did you read that column, and what was your reaction to it?
00:28:44Yeah, I saw it, and I don't know exactly what the context was to begin with,
00:28:48because it sounded like it was a conversation that was captured, sort of.
00:28:52You know, the first thing – I actually spoke with Andrew here, the head of racing,
00:28:56and we pulled the last few years – like, last – actually, all the way back to 2009, really.
00:29:01And I'm not exactly seeing what he's saying, at least in the last five years.
00:29:06I mean, I don't know if you are.
00:29:08We had less claiming races last year than the year before.
00:29:11But, really, what it comes down to is racing is an ecosystem.
00:29:15There's small trainers all the way up to the largest ones like Chad.
00:29:18Everyone deserves an opportunity to run.
00:29:20And it's really important that some of these smaller outfits get that chance up here.
00:29:25And owners. It's an experience. It brings people into the sport.
00:29:30Like with the television product, one of the greatest things is if we can capture somebody who's got a horse in for the first time
00:29:35and get them on camera.
00:29:37And that really just adds to the ownership experience, stuff like that.
00:29:41So, you know, I just politely disagree.
00:29:44I think it's a good thing to spread it out and give everyone opportunities.
00:29:47Yes, we want to have some of the top stakes in the country, if not the top, in this period of time.
00:29:53But you've got to fill the cards and you've got to balance in an ecosystem.
00:29:58Yeah, I mean, there's that. There's the business perspective of field size.
00:30:04I mean, field size is so important.
00:30:06And you know that if the racing office could, they would write a lot more allowance races if they could get 9, 10, 11, 12 horse fields in all of them.
00:30:17But realistically, nowadays in horse racing, that just doesn't happen.
00:30:21I mean, we can go down and talk about full crop size, available inventory.
00:30:25This is all ratios, right, Randy?
00:30:27I mean, there's ratios on what horses are going to fit where.
00:30:29You can move the ratio slightly, but it's only going to go so far.
00:30:33So, yeah, Saratoga is the top product in the U.S.
00:30:39It's going to stay the top product, obviously, and there's going to be balance in it.
00:30:44That's just the way it is.
00:30:47Dave, back to the overarching planned downstate.
00:30:52I think we in the media are guilty a little bit of taking it as a given that Aqueduct is just going to vanish and go away once the new Belmont is up and running.
00:31:02But is that accurate?
00:31:04Is the end game from Aqueduct going on behind the scenes?
00:31:09Are you planning for that?
00:31:10Or should we expect a little bit of an overlap time maybe in 26, 27 when all three tracks are still under the Naira umbrella and they're all still operational?
00:31:18Or has that been decided and etched in stone and there is an end date for Aqueduct?
00:31:24Consider this in 26 when we come back from Saratoga.
00:31:28Essentially, that would be the point where you hand the keys back, if not before.
00:31:34It's actually very positive in terms of the state giving back about 100, 110 acres at Aqueduct for development for use for the state.
00:31:42In terms of the economic equation for getting Belmont built, that's a big part of it.
00:31:47It's about a billion dollars worth of real estate sitting next to Kennedy Airport.
00:31:52We think there's really good use for it.
00:31:54And we're going to have four brand new tracks and a new building at Belmont.
00:31:58That's our primary training center downstate.
00:32:01So this equation made sense economically, and that was a big component of how it makes sense.
00:32:06Well, Dave O'Rourke, I want to thank you so much for spending some time with us.
00:32:11And I won't wish you good luck at the meet.
00:32:14I'll wish you lots of sunny skies and no rain at this meet.
00:32:18Boy, did we see what the impact that was last year.
00:32:21But I'm sure Saratoga will be a great meet this year.
00:32:25And thanks so much for joining us and sharing some of your thoughts.
00:32:28Thanks for having me.
00:32:29For appearing on the TD and Writer's Room as the Green Group Guest of the Week,
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00:33:59In this segment, T.D. Thornton, and I'm glad to have him on because right now he's got the most thankless job at the TDN,
00:34:06trying to make sense of all the lawsuits flying back and forth, the decisions and whatnot about HISA.
00:34:13And every time something happens, it gets a little bit more crazy.
00:34:17T.D., first of all, just tell us what was the, give us a synopsis of what you were writing about last week.
00:34:23Well, there wouldn't have been a holiday weekend in the racing industry without some Friday holiday news dump.
00:34:29And this one came to us courtesy of the United States Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals.
00:34:35This is the week when we talked a couple of weeks ago about HISA here on the podcast.
00:34:39We said this is the one that we're waiting for to see what goes forward and how things progress.
00:34:44However, it did muddle the picture a little bit what they said.
00:34:47So the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals has this case.
00:34:50It's a lawsuit initiated and led by the national HBPA against basically trying to derail HISA and say that the statute is not constitutional.
00:35:01Another appeals court, the Sixth Circuit, has already said HISA is constitutional.
00:35:06The law meets constitutional standards.
00:35:09It got a checkmark from the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals, but the law was challenged in the Fifth Circuit Court.
00:35:16And they came back in their ruling and they said, we like a lot of what the Sixth Circuit said.
00:35:23We think that the way the rulemaking happens in HISA has been solved by a 2022 constitutional tweak.
00:35:30Excuse me, a congressional tweak that changed the law and that made the HISA authority subordinate to the Federal Trade Commission in terms of rulemaking.
00:35:41They also said in the Friday ruling that just came out that HISA, the law HISA, does not violate the due process clause.
00:35:49So it's OK there. However, they diverge from what the Sixth Circuit Court said by bringing up another issue entirely.
00:35:56And they said it does not. The rulemaking itself is OK.
00:36:03However, the way that the HISA Act is enforced by the authority violates the private non-delegation doctrine,
00:36:11which is a way of saying that powers to a congressional type of constitutional type of powers like this cannot be delegated to a private entity.
00:36:23So now we have a scenario where the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals says one thing, the Fifth Circuit says another.
00:36:31And this is the type of case that the Supreme Court of the United States very well might handle.
00:36:35It's what they call a conflict in circuits.
00:36:39The Supreme Court very often steps in and takes these types of cases just to settle what is, quote unquote, going to be the law of the land.
00:36:47So now it's up to which side brings it to the Supreme Court.
00:36:50So if I'm if I'm reading this right, one thing that really confuses me, it sounds like the Fifth Circuit said, yeah, HISA is OK.
00:36:57It's constitutional, but we're not going to allow many enforcement powers.
00:37:02I mean, is that fairly accurate? And if so, how does that make any sense?
00:37:07Well, I don't know about the making any sense, but I think you're onto something there.
00:37:11Well, our colleague at TDN, Dan Ross, did an interview with Lucinda Finley, who's a constitutional law expert.
00:37:19And her take on this was that. So now we have a set of rules that both appeals courts have said is OK.
00:37:28It's constitutionally legal. But the enforcement of those rules is not legal.
00:37:32So what happens? That's the big question right now. We don't know. I don't I certainly don't know.
00:37:36So clarify for everyone now how a time a possible timeline.
00:37:42I mean, how long could it take for the Supreme Court to hear this and what happens to HISA in the interim?
00:37:49So right now in the interim, nothing changes.
00:37:52There is no order that came down that says they have to stop doing what they do on a daily basis.
00:37:58HISA, HISA's chief executive officer, Lisa Lazarus, in the aftermath of the decision, told TDN that, sure, we're disappointed in this outcome.
00:38:07We think there were a lot of strengths in the Sixth Circuit ruling that will hold up at the Supreme Court level if it comes to that.
00:38:14But Lisa also underscored that nothing is going to change on a day to day basis.
00:38:19So converse to that, the the winning plaintiffs in the case, the HBPA came out and via press release, they announced victory.
00:38:31They said because that this aspect of HISA was found to be unconstitutional, they are counting that as a win.
00:38:38And now it's you know, we'll see if it gets which side brings it up to the Supreme Court level.
00:38:44Our constitutional law expert that we interviewed in TDN, Lucinda Finley, seemed to indicate that she thinks it will be the HISA authority that will bring this up and elevate the case to the Supreme Court's level.
00:38:56Somebody has to bring it there for the Supreme Court to say, yes, we're going to take this case or we're not.
00:39:02And Ms. Finley's idea was that the HISA authority should bring the case to the Supreme Court, but only focus on the one narrow aspect of the enforcement being unconstitutional in the Fifth Circuit court and try to get that resolved.
00:39:20And then it would be incumbent upon the HBPA plaintiffs and everybody else who's enjoined on their side of the case to try to bring in other issues that they think should be contested at the Supreme Court level.
00:39:30Supreme Court has pretty much ended its session for the year.
00:39:34They run on a calendar that goes from from October until about this time, late June, early July.
00:39:41So this would have to be a fresh case that that gets brought to the Supreme Court sometime in the fall.
00:39:46And then they decide whether they want to take it or not.
00:39:48It's a process that will last at the very least through the winter and into next year at this time.
00:39:53And it could drag on even longer.
00:39:55T.D., one thing the Supreme Court did already do was the story before the story where they asked the people and the plaintiffs in the Fifth, excuse me, the Sixth Circuit case wanted to appeal.
00:40:07And the Supreme Court, with the writ of certiorari is what they called it, said they're not going to take the case.
00:40:13I believe you wrote that it was a one like two word press release.
00:40:17Should pro-Heise factions be relieved by the fact that the Supreme Court, though they haven't ruled on it, has kind of shown their cards a little bit here?
00:40:29Well, yes and no, I think. I mean, no in that at the time that that ruling came out about three weeks ago, that they said they weren't going to take a Sixth Circuit appeal.
00:40:39There were no conflicting cases. The Fifth Circuit hadn't come out and ruled.
00:40:43So it's not surprising the Supreme Court gets ten thousands such petitions a year.
00:40:50And what really is the bar for whether they take one oftentimes, not always, is are there two appeals courts at the federal level in conflict?
00:41:00That wasn't the case a few weeks ago. Now it is. I think that changes the dynamic.
00:41:05I think going back to the first part of your question, what should the pro-Heise forces take heart in?
00:41:11I think they should definitely take heart. It's a huge, quote unquote, win for them, or it's a huge checkmark in their favor that the Fifth Circuit did say all of the things that they front loaded up at the beginning of their ruling before they said that the enforcement mechanism was not constitutional.
00:41:30The rulemaking was solved by Congress, the Fifth Circuit said. They agreed with the Sixth Circuit on that.
00:41:34It doesn't violate the due process clause. They agreed on that.
00:41:38So there are a lot of things in agreement. There is just that one, you know, you can say that little aspect that's not, but it isn't a little aspect.
00:41:45The enforcement mechanism is huge. It's what the Heise authority and by extension, HIWU do on a day-to-day basis.
00:41:52I don't think you could go back to Congress and say, hey, rewrite the law again with another tweak that we're going to shove into a budget bill that gets passed at the end of the year because this one is going to be a little more difficult to tweak from a writing the law standpoint than solving the rulemaking process, which is what got solved by rewriting the law with just a few words in 2022.
00:42:15I'm sorry, Randy.
00:42:17One more question for you.
00:42:19Since the court, the one court has said that the enforcement arm of the Heise, HIWU is something that they don't believe should be proper and it's legal.
00:42:29What if I'm a trainer, I get a positive tomorrow for some bad stuff and the wheels start turning and eventually Heise wants to give me a suspension of two years.
00:42:39Can my lawyers argue that a court of appeals, Fifth Circuit has ruled that you can't do this?
00:42:48Could this be an avenue or a way of clever lawyers try to get these cases thrown out?
00:42:59I'm sure it will be utilized.
00:43:01Whether or not that works, that's the zillion dollar question that I don't have an answer to.
00:43:06You're looking at this thing from 35,000 feet.
00:43:09I mean, we all know thoroughbred racing has over the decades has a special affinity for shooting itself in the foot.
00:43:18Seen it time and time again.
00:43:20I mean, there were other attempts to come up with something similar to Heise that have gone on in past decades.
00:43:28And those all seem to end at the legislative level when legislators just threw their hands up and said, look, we can't get people within horse racing to cooperate.
00:43:38How are we ever going to do something like this?
00:43:40And then finally, things got so bad in thoroughbred racing that Mitch McConnell and others got together and just decided, OK, we have to get this done, even though there's so much infighting and we'll deal with that later.
00:43:54And so Heise was born and this is where we're at right now.
00:43:58We all have strong opinions about it.
00:44:00I know I have strong opinions about it.
00:44:02I don't agree with what the National HBPA is doing.
00:44:05But, you know, I guess in the end, we live in a democracy, right?
00:44:11There are avenues like this for other well-intentioned people like those in the HBPA and some trainers who disagree with Heise and who strongly believe, as we might strongly believe otherwise, that Heise is not a good thing and that it's unconstitutional.
00:44:31So it's going to go down to the Supreme Court, ultimately, we think, and so be it.
00:44:36But I think they'll prevail.
00:44:38But I'm trying to be optimistic.
00:44:41And that's kind of the way I'm looking at it right now.
00:44:43This is the democratic process.
00:44:45And let's get it done, get it over with and move on.
00:44:49TD, set a line.
00:44:50What's the line on two questions?
00:44:52Yes, Heise survives.
00:44:53No, Heise doesn't survive.
00:44:55Three to five, it survives.
00:44:56Six to five, it doesn't.
00:44:58Give me your guess.
00:45:01I think that because I have to objectively report on this, I'm tantalizing and it's at the tip of my tongue.
00:45:10And I do want to give you that number.
00:45:12But because I have to objectively report on this, I'm not going to come down on one side or the other.
00:45:17But I think the overarching question that I'll be asking in my reporting as this goes on is, to what end does the HBPA want to keep fighting this?
00:45:26I mean, what is the end game?
00:45:28When you add up all of the costs at the time, and as our constitutional law expert, Lucinda Finley, pointed out in her article in TDN last week, does there come a tipping point where even people who are initially supportive of the HBPA's efforts say,
00:45:44hey, geez, some aspects of this are working.
00:45:47It's ending up ostensibly in safer racing.
00:45:51It's ostensibly ending up with cheaters being knocked out of the game.
00:45:55Sure, there is some collateral damage.
00:45:57We've talked about that at length, the three of us on this podcast and different podcasts.
00:46:00But you have to wonder if at some point people say, hey, you know, there is a framework here.
00:46:06It's on the way to working.
00:46:09It's not quite where it needs to be.
00:46:11But do we really just want to abandon this and go with who knows what else?
00:46:16I mean, that's going to be the question that needs to be answered.
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00:47:43Well, Saratoga is upon us.
00:47:45We're taping this on Tuesday.
00:47:46Opening day is Thursday.
00:47:48I thought it'd be fun to just, let's just take a look at this Saturday card and see if our panel of experts can come up with a couple of winners.
00:47:55And, you know, it's very typical of what to expect at Saratoga.
00:47:59You have three stakes races on the card, including the Diana, which is a grade one.
00:48:04Some very good betting races.
00:48:05Let's hope the weather holds up.
00:48:07I've heard conflicting reports about what the weather is going to be this weekend in Saratoga.
00:48:11But, boy, Naira sure deserves a break.
00:48:14Hopefully they can get sunny skies for their opening weekend.
00:48:17So the Kelso is a grade three, one mile on the grass.
00:48:21They've moved this race around a lot.
00:48:23And now, I guess, it used to be one time it was a prep for the Breeders' Cup mile.
00:48:28Then it became a prep for the Cigar mile.
00:48:31Now I imagine it's a prep for the four-star Dave.
00:48:34But I made a mistake over the weekend.
00:48:37I actually, for the first time in my life, picked against Charlie Appleby in some races.
00:48:42Never again.
00:48:43Never again.
00:48:44In Mysterious Night in the Kelso, you know, he's got Flavien Pratt aboard.
00:48:50A bunch of these horses are coming out of the poker stakes.
00:48:53The winner isn't, but I think the second, third, and fourth place finishers.
00:48:57He just looks like the best among this group.
00:49:00Ran a good race last time out.
00:49:02Didn't particularly seem to have a bad trip.
00:49:04But, Dennis, speaking of stakes race fields, this is a grass stakes race with a $175,000 purse.
00:49:11And they have a field of five.
00:49:14So this is a problem that is not going away.
00:49:17But my pick in the Kelso will be Mysterious Night.
00:49:21You know, when Charlie Appleby and Godolphin decided to bring a string over here,
00:49:26basically full-time for 2024, and a select string and focus on these major stakes races on turf,
00:49:33Saratoga was what they were really pointing at as much as anything else.
00:49:37And so Mysterious Night is just the first, the opening salvo in what promises to be a very successful
00:49:45and profitable meeting for Appleby and the Godolphin clan.
00:49:50What I found interesting, you know, the DRF does its divisional rankings every week.
00:49:56You know, the top three-year-olds, top older horses, top sprinters.
00:50:00In the category of top male turf horses, a category that you would think we've been conditioned to think
00:50:06that Chad Brown would tend to dominate.
00:50:09I think it's either six of the top seven or six of the top eight in the DRF divisional rankings
00:50:17are all Godolphin trained by Charlie Appleby.
00:50:21It's just amazing the strength that these guys have.
00:50:24And that is going to come to bear during the Saratoga meet.
00:50:27And I agree, Mysterious Night's definitely the horse to beat in a disappointingly small field in the Kelso.
00:50:35And if you gave me good enough odds on the sun coming up in the west, I'd probably take a flyer on that.
00:50:40So in that spirit, I'm going to try and beat the Godolphin Appleby horse here.
00:50:44I go with Carl Spackler, trying to be a little bit of a wise guy here.
00:50:48He's two for three over the inner turf at Saratoga.
00:50:52He won the opening verse on Derby Weekend at Churchill Two Starts Back on the Belmont Stakes Festival up at the spa.
00:50:59He was three wide on both turns in the poker.
00:51:01So just trying to toss a couple of bucks in his direction, hoping to get lucky.
00:51:05And it's one of the coolest names in horse racing, too.
00:51:07Carl Spackler, of course, from the Bill Murray character in Caddyshack.
00:51:11All right, so we go to the big feature of the day.
00:51:13That's the Diana. Grade one, 500,000.
00:51:16And, you know, every year we're faced with the same dilemma.
00:51:19OK, Chad Brown, but which Chad Brown?
00:51:22He's won this race eight times, six of the last seven runnings, and has five horses in this race.
00:51:29Randy, isn't this the race last year, the year before he ran one, two, three, four in?
00:51:34Yeah. Yeah. OK.
00:51:36So obviously, Chad Brown is somebody that you have to take a big look at.
00:51:40And among his horses, I'm not saying other people can't win, but I kind of like White Beam, who won this race last year.
00:51:48It's coming off a second place finish in the just a game at a mile, stretches out a little bit, a mile and an eighth here.
00:51:54And this horse hasn't been necessarily a winning machine.
00:51:58It's only won, hasn't won since July of 23.
00:52:02But there's very little pace in this race.
00:52:04And I think Flavien Pratt can take advantage of that.
00:52:07I don't know if this horse is going to go right to the front, but this horse will be forwardly placed with a slow pace up front.
00:52:14And I think that's all the kind of break that this horse is going to need to give Chad Brown his ninth win in the Diana Stiggs.
00:52:23Yeah, I purposely, I have to admit, I don't play these type of races either in a pick three or a pick four sequence.
00:52:31I don't mean I don't play the type of races where one trainer loads up with almost half the field.
00:52:36It's just inscrutable to me. So Chad Brown having five of the eleven entrants here is probably a race that personally I will not realistically play.
00:52:43But for trying to be a public handicapper wise guy again, we'll go with a little bit of a price horse in here.
00:52:49Mission of Joy for Graham Motion.
00:52:51Winless in over a year, however, tantalizingly close at odds of 13 to 1, 14 to 1, 25 to 1.
00:52:59Beaten a half length, a length, two lengths.
00:53:02Perhaps Saturday will be the day at a price.
00:53:05So, all right, looking at this, obviously I put my handicapper hat on, which I put on quite frequently.
00:53:13Yes, Swipe Beam will be advantaged by a likely slow pace in the Diana.
00:53:22But she was also advantaged by a very slow pace in her last race in the Just a Game.
00:53:31But Chili Flag, her stable mate, went from last to first despite the super slow pace and had this huge kick,
00:53:40which she displayed in her previous two starts as well and rolled past Swipe Beam in the late stages.
00:53:46So she went the last quarter, by the way, in that race in 22.12 seconds.
00:53:52The last 16th of a mile, five and four.
00:53:57This five-year-old mare has just a remarkable stretch burst, even with no pace in the race.
00:54:04So I see no reason if the Just a Game was at a mile and now the Diana is at a mile and an eighth,
00:54:12why Chili Flag wouldn't be even more effective.
00:54:15But what's interesting to me here is, so Chad's got five of the eight horses in the race.
00:54:21He's won it, what'd you say, eight times?
00:54:23Yep.
00:54:24He might not be the favorite.
00:54:26Diddia, on paper, looks like she might wind up being the post-time favorite.
00:54:30I think it's going to be close between Diddia and Chili Flag just because of the Chad Brown factor.
00:54:35But, I mean, Diddia is in fantastic form.
00:54:38She won the Pegasus filly and mare.
00:54:40She's coming off a win in the New York at the Saratoga Meet at a mile and three-sixteenths.
00:54:45Now she shortens up, but that hasn't been a problem for her in the past.
00:54:48She's won 11 out of 17 races.
00:54:50She's hitting on all cylinders.
00:54:52And Moira is no slouch either, but she hasn't had a race this year yet.
00:54:57It's a fantastic race, and it doesn't necessarily have to go Chad Brown's way.
00:55:02We shall see.
00:55:03It usually does in Saratoga and the turf races, especially for fillies.
00:55:07The 11th race is the Sanford, and it's starting to get exciting.
00:55:10There's many, many, many two-year-olds yet to come.
00:55:14We'll have five or six maiden winners during the meet.
00:55:17We'll be TDN rising stars, and everybody will be talking about them.
00:55:21And the story, of course, in the Sanford is Menti, the full brother to Fierceness,
00:55:25who won first time out by a mere nose.
00:55:28But the buyer figure is an 88.
00:55:31That's the highest figure of any two-year-old in the country so far, right, Randy?
00:55:35Yes.
00:55:36Menti, okay.
00:55:38So, you know, that horse has a lot of upside and will be a deserving favorite.
00:55:41I'm going to try to beat him, though, with Studley Do-Right,
00:55:45the horse that shipped in from Maryland to win the Tremont Stakes.
00:55:48This horse had a really – you know, his number's an 82, so he's in the ballpark.
00:55:52That's the second-fastest number in the race.
00:55:55And I really like this last race in the Tremont.
00:55:57He was pretty far back.
00:55:59Didn't look like he had much of a chance, and he just really turned it up,
00:56:02an explosive stretch kick, to get there in time to win for the Maryland connection.
00:56:07So, obviously, Menti is the horse to watch.
00:56:09It would be very curious, too, to see if Menti starts running bad races every other race.
00:56:15You know, is it something wrong in the genes of these poor horses?
00:56:19So, if he's like his brother, this is his race that he's not going to run in.
00:56:23But, anyway, Studley Do-Right for me.
00:56:25Yeah, his brother fierceness, obviously.
00:56:29The only way I could pick against Menti in this spot would be if Colloquial came back to run against him again.
00:56:38Colloquial was the equally talented horse that ran in that same maiden race at Belmont at Aqueduct on June the 15th
00:56:44and finished just a nose behind Menti and was eating up ground late.
00:56:48You can make the case, like all trainers always do.
00:56:51Menti was coasting.
00:56:54He was out there by himself.
00:56:57He was lost.
00:56:58He was getting distracted, all these other excuses that people come up with.
00:57:03But Colloquial is not in this race.
00:57:06And so, therefore, I think Menti has a huge talent edge over the field, even over Studley Do-Right, I think.
00:57:12So, I think it's going to be awfully tough to beat Menti in this spot.
00:57:16And as a testament to the age in which we live, how odd is it to look at the past performances for opening weekend of Saratoga
00:57:24and see that there are two-year-olds who have already started at Saratoga
00:57:28because a couple of these horses did come out of the Tremont Stakes on the Belmont Stakes Festival of Racing.
00:57:33So, that was a little bit of an odd quirk when I tried to decipher the race.
00:57:36I landed on three echoes in here.
00:57:39He was third in the Tremont.
00:57:41Had a little bit of a rough trip for a very short race.
00:57:43He broke in and bumped at the brake, but he quickly recovered.
00:57:47Vied at the rail inside of the favorite.
00:57:50The favorite looked like he was getting away from him at the top of the lane.
00:57:52They both went kind of wide.
00:57:54Three echoes cut back down inside.
00:57:56Actually got in front at the eighth pole.
00:57:58Was put in a little bit tight.
00:57:59Probably didn't cost him anything at the 16th pole.
00:58:02And then Bill's horse came lumbering on by to pick them both up at the wire.
00:58:06But I think three echoes has the speed enough to pressure and be a pace presence.
00:58:11And I think he's going to benefit from that race over the track and he'll stick out the trip.
00:58:15So, while we're on the topic of two-year-olds, this is not a Saratoga topic.
00:58:19At least not yet.
00:58:20But I want to roll out one more horse here to put on your radar screen.
00:58:23And he's been flying or she has been flying very much under the radar.
00:58:27There is a two-year-old filly that just won at Prairie Meadows in a stakes race this past weekend.
00:58:34Her name is White Sands.
00:58:36She's owned by the Coolmore Group.
00:58:38She's trained by Wesley Ward.
00:58:40She's had two lifetime starts.
00:58:42She broke her maiden at Belterra by nine and a half.
00:58:44Then they ran her against boys at Prairie Meadows in a stake.
00:58:47She won by 13 and three quarters in that race.
00:58:52She's got one eye.
00:58:54As a foal in an accident, she lost her right eye.
00:58:59She really doesn't know any better because she was just a baby when it happened.
00:59:03But her next start will probably be at Saratoga.
00:59:07So, White Sands is a horse to put on your radar screen.
00:59:10She also happens to be a half-sister to Jackie's Warrior.
00:59:14So, speed runs in the family.
00:59:17You're just giving me a good idea for a TDN story.
00:59:20Thank you, Randy.
00:59:21You're welcome.
00:59:22Okay.
00:59:23Well, anyways, that's opening week at Saratoga.
00:59:25There are obviously other big races, but I just wanted to focus in on those three.
00:59:29Now, we had talked earlier about Mentee, who's going to be the favorite in Sanford.
00:59:33He is the XBTV Work of the Week.
00:59:35Mentee is.
00:59:36He's the half-brother to Fierceness by City of Light,
00:59:39who broke his maiden on his debut on June 15th at Belmont at the Big A.
00:59:42Mentee worked four furlongs in 49.05 on Sunday in Saratoga
00:59:47in company with unlimited potential.
00:59:49Trainer Todd Pletcher said that Mentee will head next to Sanford Stakes
00:59:52this Saturday, July 13th at Saratoga.
00:59:55We'll be right back after this message from XBTV.
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01:00:52West Point Thoroughbreds.
01:00:54The gold standard in racing partnerships.
01:00:56Visit westpointtb.com.
01:01:00We always like to talk about West Point Thoroughbreds
01:01:03because, after all, West Point is a sponsor of the TDN Writer's Room.
01:01:07It was another week, another stakes win for West Point.
01:01:10This time it was Saturday's grade three 6.5 furlong Hindery stakes at Woodbine
01:01:14where a gal in a rush appeared to be in no rush whatsoever
01:01:18until she approached the stretch of the Hindery.
01:01:21Then she went from last to first for her first stakes win
01:01:24and West Point's 13th stakes win this year alone.
01:01:28She's a Ghost Zapper Philly trained by Christophe Clement,
01:01:30was ridden by Kazushi Kimura.
01:01:33Then there's Saratoga this week.
01:01:35West Point has three runners in the first three days of the week,
01:01:37including Northern Invader going against Mysterious Knight in Saturday's Kelso stakes.
01:01:41Another track opening this week is Colonial Downs
01:01:44where on Saturday, West Point's Integration looks like a solid favorite
01:01:48in the Million Preview stakes, as in Arlington Million,
01:01:52for trainer Shook McGahee.
01:01:53And we know Integration loves Colonial Downs.
01:01:57To find out how you can be a part of all this action,
01:01:59visit westpointtb.com.
01:02:07Well, that's a wrap for this week's show.
01:02:09I want to thank you for joining us.
01:02:10I want to thank my partners, Randy Moss and T.D. Thornton.
01:02:14And by the way, the story on Zoe,
01:02:16apparently her car broke down on the way to Saratoga.
01:02:19I'm not making this up.
01:02:21She got stranded in Utah?
01:02:23Utah.
01:02:24Her car broke down on the way to Saratoga.
01:02:27So she must be like in New Jersey, right?
01:02:30Yeah.
01:02:31Utah.
01:02:33So let's hope she makes it there by Traverse Day.
01:02:36It broke down on holiday weekend, on 4th of July weekend,
01:02:39and she couldn't find anybody to work on it.
01:02:42Poor Zoe.
01:02:43Well, she'll be back, I'm sure, next week.
01:02:45But T.D., as usual, did a great job.
01:02:47We thank him for filling in.
01:02:49I want to thank the Green Group Guests of the Week, David O'Rourke,
01:02:51and our producers, Katie Petruniak, Anthony LaRocca, and Aliyah LaRocca.
01:02:56Thanks for joining us.
01:02:57Check up with you again next week on the TDN Writer's Room Podcast.
01:03:00I'm David O'Rourke.
01:03:01And I'm Aliyah LaRocca.