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00:00:00For the love of the horse, for generations to come.
00:00:28And welcome to a Prankness Week edition of the Thoroughbred Daily News TDN Writers Podcast.
00:00:34I'm Bill Finley.
00:00:35I'm a correspondent for the Thoroughbred Daily News.
00:00:37You can catch me every Saturday from 10 to 2 Eastern on Sirius XM Radio along with Dave
00:00:42Johnson on Down the Stretch.
00:00:43Look forward to that.
00:00:44I am Randy Moss with NBC Sports here trackside basically behind the grandstand by the Steaks
00:00:51Barn in an ugly NBC trailer at an old hilltop guys.
00:00:56I'm Zoe Cabman with First Racing and I'm here in the Sheraton in Baltimore.
00:01:02So we're both here, Randy.
00:01:03They might have to get tied on.
00:01:05I want to remind you that the TDN Writers Room Podcast is brought to you each week by
00:01:09Keeneland.
00:01:10So let's get right into the Prankness, guys.
00:01:12And there's a couple of different storylines, one of which is the obvious one, only one
00:01:16horse coming back from the Kentucky Derby and Mage.
00:01:20But let's save that topic for a little bit later in the show because we're going to talk
00:01:22about something that is now very relevant, whether or not it's time to change the Triple
00:01:27Crown structures, mainly the spacing between the races.
00:01:30So let's just, you know, look at this race like we did from the Derby, kind of a, I don't
00:01:34think we need to go down each and every horse, but an overview of the race.
00:01:38And the way I see it, Mage is clearly on paper the best horse.
00:01:42I mean, I don't think there's any doubt about that.
00:01:45He's got the 105 fire in the Derby where he beat what will be a much tougher field than
00:01:50what he's facing in the Prankness on Saturday.
00:01:53Can he do it again?
00:01:54I guess if he runs back to his Derby performance, I think he will win, Randy.
00:01:59But you know, there are the questions of the two weeks, how it's going to affect him.
00:02:03Also a horse that, again, we're talking about, they were asking a lot of him in the Kentucky
00:02:07Derby because he hadn't raced more than three times, hadn't raced as a two year old.
00:02:11You know, is this perhaps the race where it catches up with him?
00:02:15You know, we'll find out on Saturday, but you don't have to be a genius to predict that
00:02:19he's going to be the solid favorite in here, and quite frankly, the most likely winner
00:02:23by a wide margin, I would say.
00:02:26Based on the most recent efforts of all the horses, yes, I would agree with that.
00:02:33But then the question becomes, which horses are capable of improving like Mage did in
00:02:40his numbers dramatically in the Kentucky Derby?
00:02:43Which horses, you know, might Mage be susceptible to regression a little bit?
00:02:49Since the pace was a really good setup for him, a surprisingly fast pace in the Kentucky
00:02:55Derby, probably, and I say that with emphasis because the Derby pace was a surprise, but
00:03:01probably he won't get that kind of a pace in the Preakness, even though there does seem
00:03:06to be some legitimate speed.
00:03:08So yeah, I agree with you that on paper, based on their most recent races, Mage's Kentucky
00:03:14Derby stands out.
00:03:16But as we all know, races usually aren't run that simplistically.
00:03:22Yeah, and you're absolutely right.
00:03:25And on paper, he's the best horse.
00:03:26And you know, what's really interesting about this is that it was a few years ago, I had
00:03:31a conversation with Bob Baffert, who's the equal winningest Preakness trainer in history
00:03:37with seven to his name.
00:03:40And I said, why does, how come you always win the Preakness with the horse you win the
00:03:45Derby with?
00:03:46Because he invariably seems to win the Preakness.
00:03:48He might not always win the Triple Crown, but he does it.
00:03:51And he said, it's simple.
00:03:53I've got the best horse.
00:03:55And that, if you have the best horse in the Derby, now not always does the best horse
00:04:00win the Derby, but generally, the best horse in the Derby will be the best horse in the
00:04:05Preakness.
00:04:08And if that is the actual case, then he should win.
00:04:12And you know, some horses handle it very easily.
00:04:14You come back, you do an easy half mile work or you two minute lick.
00:04:18You don't really have to do anything.
00:04:19You don't have to overthink anything.
00:04:21If your horse was primed and ready to run in the Kentucky Derby and everything's okay
00:04:27with him, he should be fine to run in the Preakness if he's the best horse.
00:04:32And we'll have to see if Mage is the best horse.
00:04:35On paper, yes.
00:04:36There are others in there like First Mission who draws the outside, who's got a tremendous
00:04:42resume much like Mage, and he didn't have the grueling run two weeks ago in the Preakness.
00:04:49So he's definitely knocking on the door for trainer Brad Cox.
00:04:53But I thought it was really interesting to listen to Bob, you know, if you've got the
00:04:56best horse in the Derby, that's why, and that's his perspective and his training regime.
00:05:01And that's why he has been so successful in having the Derby winner come back and win
00:05:08the Preakness.
00:05:09You know, sometimes we tend to make these things too complicated.
00:05:12Who's the best horse?
00:05:14As Zoe pointed out, it's the Derby winner.
00:05:15I mean, there's really no doubt about that.
00:05:17Okay.
00:05:18So team, let's all come up though with an alternative.
00:05:20If he's not going to win, who is going to beat him?
00:05:23And I got kind of an out of the box theory here.
00:05:27How about perform?
00:05:29Manny, this is heresy if you're a buyer fan, because his last figure was 20 points slower
00:05:34than Mage, who ran an 85 in the Federico Tessio.
00:05:37But first of all, there's no bigger Shug McGahee fan than I am.
00:05:41And why would Shug McGahee be running him in this race?
00:05:44We have to pay $150,000 to supplement him.
00:05:48You know, I don't know how much, Shug, how much is the owner's, but that is a huge vote
00:05:52of confidence.
00:05:53And do yourself a favor, folks, go back and look at his Federico Tessio.
00:05:57I mean, who did he beat?
00:05:59Probably nobody.
00:06:00The number's no good, but it was very impressive.
00:06:03This horse in the 316th pole didn't have a prayer.
00:06:06He was blocked on the inside under Fergal Lynch, and somehow he won the race.
00:06:10So to me, he's a horse that's going to improve.
00:06:13I might have to improve 15 legs to beat Mage, but there's my kind of wise guy horse.
00:06:17What do you guys got?
00:06:19I'm right in there with you, Bill.
00:06:22Take your flare pin on the past performances next to that 85.
00:06:27Just put plus, plus, plus next to that.
00:06:30Because perform only got to run a 16th of a mile in the Tessio, and just absolutely
00:06:36ran over horses toward the end.
00:06:38And it is important, I think, to read between the lines, knowing the conservative nature
00:06:45of Shug McGahee, that he would recommend to the owners that they put up $150,000 to supplement
00:06:51this horse.
00:06:53He was a maiden at the beginning of March, so he is really trending in the right direction.
00:06:58And I think he is a legitimate long shot chance, but it's not just him.
00:07:02For example, National Treasure.
00:07:04He's got blinkers on.
00:07:05He's got the rail.
00:07:06He's almost certainly going to go to the lead.
00:07:08Now, can you confidently play National Treasure against Mage based on the races that we've
00:07:15seen this year for National Treasure, and maybe even a couple of races last year?
00:07:20No.
00:07:21As we all know, some horses get brave, and some horses run their best races when they're
00:07:25in front.
00:07:26And with the blinkers on, and probably the lead in the rail if he breaks with Johnny
00:07:30B, there is the distinct possibility that National Treasure is going to run maybe a
00:07:37lifetime best.
00:07:39Is that good enough to beat Mage?
00:07:40If Mage regresses a little bit from the Kentucky Derby with the two weeks, and with the slightly
00:07:44softer early fractions, maybe, yes.
00:07:48Entirely a possibility.
00:07:49And as Zoe pointed out, First Mission is going in the right direction as well with Brad Cox.
00:07:55Despite Iran Ortiz's best efforts in the Lexington Stakes, he managed to win that race anyway,
00:08:01and seems to be a horse that's really just like Performer, trending upward.
00:08:07Yeah.
00:08:08You know, it's not a one-horse race.
00:08:11People are moaning and bitching that it's not a good race.
00:08:15I think it's a good race because it's fairly evenly matched.
00:08:19Now, I'm going to throw one out, and you're going to be like, oh my God, the horses that
00:08:22beat him, they're just awful.
00:08:24But Blazing Sevens, okay, so Tapper Trees beat him.
00:08:27He didn't run anywhere.
00:08:28Verified beat him.
00:08:29He didn't run anywhere.
00:08:30He was third to the pair of them in the bluegrass.
00:08:33Chad Brown has pointed him specifically to this race.
00:08:36Now, I've not seen him in the flesh at Pimlico, but boy, I've seen him galloping over the
00:08:41track there.
00:08:42And Hubba Hubba, does he look damn good.
00:08:46Comes in with a very, very good work at Belmont Park.
00:08:50You can find that on XBTV.
00:08:52Quick plug there.
00:08:53Gets a rad Ortiz.
00:08:55I don't know if he's good enough, but just everything's leaning me towards Blazing Sevens.
00:09:00I love Perform, just purely after watching that race back.
00:09:05He could have won by an absolute pole if he'd wanted to, and I'm a big Shuggy fan as well.
00:09:10And first mission is going to get tested.
00:09:12And then you got National Treasure on the rail with Bob Baffert, his first runner in
00:09:16the Triple Crown in two years.
00:09:18You don't think he doesn't want to win this?
00:09:20It's going to be a terrific race.
00:09:22I'm not sure what kind of price we're going to get on any of these, but I'm really looking
00:09:28forward to it.
00:09:29Now, speaking of Bob Baffert, the day before is the Black Eyed Susans.
00:09:33It's got the heavy favorite Faisa, and this is a horse, you know, in all honesty, the
00:09:37Kentucky Oaks just was kind of a race without a lot of sizzle.
00:09:41And part of the reason was the best three-year-old filly in the country, who was Faisa, was not
00:09:46in that race.
00:09:47And you know, we know the backstory and the politics and the bad blood between owner Michael
00:09:52Lund Pedersen and Churchill Downs over the Baffert one.
00:09:56Zoe, you've been a big Faisa fan from day one.
00:09:59She looks awful hard to beat in there.
00:10:01How good is she?
00:10:02Oh, she's good.
00:10:03He is really good.
00:10:05And honestly, I'm not sure she's been any better.
00:10:08She's always been the kind of filly.
00:10:10She didn't wow you as a two-year-old.
00:10:13She was just okay as a two-year-old, but her last race was absolutely terrific.
00:10:18Watching her in the paddock that day, and I even said to Bob right after it, I'm like,
00:10:23what?
00:10:24Like she was actually animated.
00:10:25Usually she comes out like an old donkey.
00:10:27She's got her head down and she's just walking along and she just does just enough to win
00:10:31by a head or a neck or whatever it is.
00:10:35She came out and she won by six and a half.
00:10:37And she came bouncing onto that racetrack and looked like a different filly that we've
00:10:41seen before.
00:10:42Even Bob was like, I was a little worried in the paddock because I've never seen her
00:10:46so animated.
00:10:47So I think she's just now coming into her own.
00:10:51I really, really do.
00:10:52I agree that her absence took a lot of luster out of the Kentucky Oaks.
00:10:57I mean, when the best three-year-old filly in training is in training and is healthy
00:11:02and can't run in the Kentucky Oaks, then that obviously is a sort of a black mark on
00:11:07the race.
00:11:08And the owner, Michael Lund-Peterson, has said he wants to be loyal to his team.
00:11:13He said that everything that he's accomplished in racing has been because of Bob Baffert,
00:11:18which is why he didn't want to transfer Faiza to another trainer just to be eligible to
00:11:25run in the Kentucky Oaks.
00:11:26So this is basically Faiza's Kentucky Oaks.
00:11:29And Michael Lund-Peterson lives in Baltimore, so this is kind of a special situation for
00:11:37him as well.
00:11:39So yeah, I think she's an absolute standout.
00:11:41Merlaza is interesting to me, trained by Brad Cox, coming off a win at Oaklawn in the Valley
00:11:48of the Vapors stakes.
00:11:50I don't think she's as good as Faiza, but if you go back and watch that race, it's not
00:11:54performed, okay?
00:11:57But Merlaza was trapped in the middle of a pack in a really slow-paced race in Oaklawn,
00:12:05going a mile, which is a short stretch, ending at the 16th hole.
00:12:09And she couldn't get out.
00:12:10I mean, she was stuck, and she was a little bit keen and wanting to go, the pace was so
00:12:15slow and couldn't go anywhere.
00:12:17I believe it was Joelle Rosario that was on her that day, yes it was.
00:12:23She was three lengths off the pace or so, and he finally got out at the quarter pole.
00:12:28So that's a short run to the 16th hole, to the finish, and whoosh!
00:12:32She just rushed by horses, not top, top-level horses, although they weren't bad.
00:12:37So to me, that's a pretty good exacto.
00:12:40Faiza and Merlaza in the Black Edges.
00:12:43That was the Santa Anita Oaks that she won, and she was terrific.
00:12:46And I can remember having a conversation with Michael Lund-Peterson, he's like, this is
00:12:50my Kentucky Oaks, the Santa Anita Oaks.
00:12:53He's like, I'll see you in Baltimore.
00:12:55And that was the plan from the get-go.
00:12:57So everything has just worked out fine, and he's going to be super excited.
00:13:01That was the first time he'd ever actually watched her run in person.
00:13:04And he was beside himself.
00:13:06He was just absolutely delighted.
00:13:08It was cool.
00:13:09All right, we'll see how Faiza does in the Black Eyes.
00:13:13Susan, hey, Joey, what's going on with Keeneland?
00:13:15Well, we're going to talk about the world's biggest yearling sale.
00:13:19Of course, the TDM Writers Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:13:22The September Keeneland Yearling Sale returns on September the 11th through the 23rd.
00:13:27Learn more at theworldyearlingsale.com.
00:13:30And don't forget that four Keeneland sales graduates are all running in the Preakness.
00:13:36We have Mage, Blazing Sevens, Chase the Chaos, and Perform.
00:13:40We'll be right back after this message from Keeneland.
00:13:43If this place could talk, it would roar.
00:13:53It would say, this is a race.
00:13:57This beating heart in the heart of horse country, steady and strong beneath the roar,
00:14:05reminding us why, for the love of the horse, for generations to come.
00:14:13Maximum Security proves he's the real deal with a gate-to-wire win in the Florida Derby.
00:14:19Champion three-year-old.
00:14:21Maximum Security has won the TBG.com Haskell Invitational.
00:14:26Eleven triple-digit buyers.
00:14:28Maximum Security, he smoked them in the cigar mile.
00:14:33Grade one winning four-year-old.
00:14:34Maximum Security takes them all the way in the TBG Pacific Classic.
00:14:39Secure your mare's future.
00:14:41Maximum Security.
00:14:44Justify's rebellious stage of $450,000 Keeneland September yearling purchase for the BSW Crow
00:14:51Colts group won his debut by seven lengths at Pimlico on Saturday, and he looked absolutely
00:14:58terrific.
00:14:58He was trained by Brittany Russell.
00:15:01Meanwhile, Mendelsohn also had an eye-catching winner at Churchill Downs on Saturday when
00:15:06his three-year-old filly, Cecile, came from last to first on the Churchill turf to get
00:15:10up for a half-length win.
00:15:13And over in France, viva la France, we'll talk to the French a little bit later on with
00:15:17Remy and Peb.
00:15:18Uncle Moe was the sire of the third most expensive juvenile at the Arcana Breeze-Up sale on Saturday
00:15:25when Jamin McCalmont, Billy the Kid to his friends, went to 600,000 euros for the Colt.
00:15:32Just on behalf of Coolmore, Jamin McCalmont told the TDN that the juvenile will be heading
00:15:36back to the U.S. where he'll join Todd Pletcher's bar.
00:15:40Pimlico, a sister track of Santa Anita.
00:15:44Zoe Zoll is on top of all things Santa Anita.
00:15:46What's going on with First Things First, Zoe?
00:15:49First Things First, I got to catch up with a new jockey, another Italian.
00:15:57It was just about six weeks ago that I stood in this exact same place and caught up with
00:16:02Frankie DeTorre and Mike Smith.
00:16:03And lo and behold, we have another Italian right here at Santa Anita.
00:16:08Antonio, tell us what led you to come here.
00:16:11Well, I've always been following American racing.
00:16:17Since unfortunately, my country, the racing is not having a great time, so I wanted to
00:16:25make a move.
00:16:26I'm very ambitious and I thought American racing could be a good move.
00:16:32So you come over specifically riding for Doug O'Neill, but you've been here not even two
00:16:35weeks.
00:16:36You've already won five races.
00:16:37Yeah, I've been blessed, lucky.
00:16:38Even on the dirt.
00:16:39I mean, lo and behold, an Italian can ride on the dirt.
00:16:45Well, in the last seven years, I was riding a lot of dirt races in Dubai.
00:16:50So let's say I have an advantage because of that.
00:16:54So who's your agent?
00:16:55My agent is Tom Canust.
00:16:57He's a good guy.
00:16:59I think he's working really hard and I got this winner because of him.
00:17:04He put me on the right horses at the right time.
00:17:05So it's very nice to work for him.
00:17:08And let's see what the future holds for us.
00:17:11How's this over here?
00:17:12Because we ride a little lighter over here.
00:17:14You hungry yet?
00:17:15You know, it's a long time I didn't have any pasta and pizza.
00:17:19So you joined a gym, right?
00:17:21Yes, I have a gym right next to my house.
00:17:25And I go pretty much every day.
00:17:29You want to do some push-ups?
00:17:31Come on.
00:17:32Come on.
00:17:33With top touch?
00:17:34Yeah.
00:17:35Ready?
00:17:36Ready?
00:17:37Ready?
00:17:38How many?
00:17:39Not too many.
00:17:40I need to ride another three.
00:17:41Ten.
00:17:42OK.
00:17:43Ready?
00:17:44Go.
00:17:45Awesome.
00:17:46Thank you so much.
00:17:47At Santa Anita Park, the Hollywood meet rolls on.
00:17:57We have a 1 p.m. post on Preakness Saturday with the gates opening at 7.15 a.m. for simulcasting.
00:18:04Don't forget the $1,500 Preakness Steaks Challenge.
00:18:07Learn more at SantaAnita.com.
00:18:10All yours, Bill.
00:18:12All right.
00:18:13So back to the other big subject, and it was a big subject last year with Rick Strike passing
00:18:17the Kentucky Derby.
00:18:18And once again, there's only eight horses in the race.
00:18:23It's a great race.
00:18:24It's the middle jewel of the Triple Crown, grade one.
00:18:26There's a lot to be excited about.
00:18:28But the fact that only one horse is coming out of the Kentucky Derby, and that's Mage,
00:18:32and everybody else just heading to the sidelines after it's over, brings up the same subject
00:18:38we've been talking about for a good 15 years or so.
00:18:41Is it finally time to change the structure of the Triple Crown?
00:18:45I mean, there's two things you could talk about, obviously, the timing between the races,
00:18:49and perhaps some people want to talk about the distances.
00:18:51But I'm more concerned with the timing between the races.
00:18:55For a hundred years, I've been writing, do not change the Triple Crown.
00:19:00It's tradition.
00:19:01And I thought if a horse won what I call the Triple Crown light, how could you stack up
00:19:08the winner of these races spread all over the calendar to the great horses that have
00:19:12won the Triple Crown over the years?
00:19:14But you know what?
00:19:15I've had enough.
00:19:17And I have totally gone over to the other side.
00:19:19And one of the reasons why I changed my mind, I'm a huge baseball fan, and I wrote this
00:19:23in the Thoroughbred Daily News.
00:19:25Baseball had a lot of problems, particularly the fact that the games just took forever.
00:19:30I mean, you get four-hour baseball games, it was boring people to death.
00:19:33And they made radical changes.
00:19:35They didn't worry about tradition, they worried about we've got to make the game as good as
00:19:39possible.
00:19:40We've got to make the product as good as possible.
00:19:43You know what?
00:19:44If baseball can do it, horse racing can do it.
00:19:45In 1979, the NBA initiated the three-point shot.
00:19:49I know that's a long time ago, but it completely changed the game of basketball.
00:19:53It was a radical change.
00:19:55The NBA has never been more popular.
00:19:56And all they do is shoot three-pointers in this day and age.
00:20:00So Randy, I don't know where you stand on this, but I'm throwing in the towel, waving
00:20:05the white flag, dammit, change the Triple Crown.
00:20:08You may be the only one that doesn't know where I stand on this, because I've been ad
00:20:12nauseam.
00:20:13I've been playing this violin now for about 15 years.
00:20:17As far as I'm concerned, we're about 10 years too late.
00:20:21And we don't know when it's going to get changed, assuming it does get changed to begin with.
00:20:26How about that?
00:20:28Andy Beier and Bill Finley were two of the last of the Mohicans, and Andy Beier changed
00:20:32last year, and now Bill Finley has seen the light here.
00:20:35Look, let me just say one more thing about it.
00:20:38There's so many things.
00:20:39I could get back on my soapbox again, but people are getting tired of hearing it.
00:20:44Tradition, okay?
00:20:47Tradition is the main reason to change the spacing.
00:20:53The tradition of the Triple Crown is simple.
00:20:56The best three-year-olds, the best horses of the generation run in the Derby, and then
00:21:01they run in the Preakness, and then they run in the Belmont.
00:21:04And that's the ones that are left running the Belmont, which is a mile and a half test
00:21:08to the champion, right?
00:21:10That's what has made the Triple Crown so special.
00:21:13That is the tradition.
00:21:14The best three-year-olds run in all three races.
00:21:18It's not happening.
00:21:19It hasn't been happening for quite a while.
00:21:22We need to get back to the tradition.
00:21:25And the way to do that is, spacing hasn't always been the way it is right now.
00:21:29It's been since 1969, but it would improve the Triple Crown series dramatically.
00:21:37People say, oh, you're making it too easy to win.
00:21:39Make it tougher to win, because you've got to beat the best horses in the Preakness as
00:21:43well as the Kentucky Derby.
00:21:44You've got to come right back and beat them again.
00:21:46Two-Phils would be the favorite in the Preakness States if he were here.
00:21:50Angel of Empire would be right there with Mage in the batting.
00:21:55Anyway, I'm not going to keep pounding this, but I'm glad you've come over, Bill.
00:22:02Zoe?
00:22:03Let me just...
00:22:04I'm just, like, climbing up to get Randy off of his soapbox and just, like, pull him back
00:22:10down here.
00:22:11Randy, you're right.
00:22:13Bill, I'm glad I can go back to baseball games.
00:22:15Thanks for that.
00:22:16Now I know it's not going to take four hours and pull the pieces out of me.
00:22:21I do like going to Cubs games, so I will always take it to Wrigley Field if anyone ever wants
00:22:26to take me.
00:22:27But, yeah, you know, it's...
00:22:31With the scratch of Forte, Derby Day, you know, 20 years ago, Empire Maker ran with
00:22:37the Bruce Foote and ran second.
00:22:39The times are changing, right?
00:22:42So Forte wouldn't have been scratched 20 years ago.
00:22:44Not saying it was right or wrong, or I believe he probably should have been scratched, but
00:22:48he would have been able to run 20 years ago.
00:22:50He'd have come back on two weeks rest and such forth.
00:22:53But perhaps it is time for a change.
00:22:55I mean, I've been resistant to it myself just because I've borne witness to some absolute
00:23:02brilliance in Southern California, and I'm so lucky to have been able to watch American
00:23:08Pharoah and Justify train pretty much every single day.
00:23:13So I know it takes brilliance, and that wasn't that long ago for these horses to show their
00:23:20brilliance.
00:23:21So that has made me second-guess it.
00:23:24Aranda, you're absolutely right.
00:23:26We need better horses to run in this race.
00:23:28I believe this year is going to be a very good competitive race, but it's not the cream
00:23:32of the crop.
00:23:33But I'm still a little bit torn after having witnessed Justify and American Pharoah be
00:23:40so brilliant, and there's only been 15 Triple Crown winners.
00:23:47Well, if you had the Preakness on Memorial Day weekend this year, you would probably
00:23:54have Mage, two fills, Angel of Empire, Disarm, Forte, maybe Confidence Game, maybe Tapit
00:24:06Trice and Dermis Sotogake.
00:24:08Oh yeah, I'm not disagreeing with you.
00:24:11National Treasure, first mission.
00:24:14Now how much of a better race would that be than the Preakness we have right now?
00:24:18Not that this is a terrible race, it's the Preakness, the second leg of the Triple Crown.
00:24:21I love the Preakness, it's fantastic.
00:24:23But look at how much better it would be, how much better it could be.
00:24:27I am definitely agreeing with you here, and it is a time of change.
00:24:32I remember when this first came up a couple of weeks ago, I can't for the life of me remember
00:24:36who it was on Twitter, but they posted each grade one three-year-old race every month.
00:24:41I'm like, oh, that would be cool.
00:24:43The first Saturday in every month, and just like took you all the way through the end
00:24:47of the year.
00:24:48So I don't know what the answer is.
00:24:50And perhaps times are changing, you know, it's time.
00:24:55I'm going to climb up and join you on your soapbox.
00:24:58Is that right?
00:24:59Yay, Zoe.
00:25:00Now some people just said make it three weeks between the Derby and Preakness, that wouldn't
00:25:04do you any good.
00:25:05I don't think that would make a big change.
00:25:08I'm with Zoe and what she said, I would make it the first Saturday of each month, the first
00:25:13Saturday in May, first Saturday in June, first Saturday in July, which wouldn't always mean
00:25:16four weeks.
00:25:17And sometimes it would mean five.
00:25:19Randy, one question I have that, you know, perfect question for you.
00:25:23This is never going to happen if the networks don't give their blessing.
00:25:27Now you have two partners in NBC and Fox.
00:25:31What's your take on that?
00:25:33Particularly NBC, would they be on board with this?
00:25:36Well, NBC would totally be on board with moving to Preakness.
00:25:43If there is a fly in the ointment here, it's NYRA, it's the New York Racing Association.
00:25:47Because right now, the Belmont Stakes is the beneficiary of the weakness of the Preakness
00:25:52Stakes because of the spacing.
00:25:54So many horses, as we've seen, run in the Derby, skip the Preakness, wait for the Belmont.
00:25:58That obviously wouldn't happen if there were eight or nine weeks between the Kentucky Derby
00:26:03and the Belmont.
00:26:04Todd Pletcher, I asked Todd Pletcher about this last year, I said, what's your opinion
00:26:07on this?
00:26:08And he kind of took a deep breath and said, you know, I've probably been the one that's
00:26:12benefited the most from this.
00:26:14But having said that, I think it's probably time to make a change in the spacing for the
00:26:19good of the Triple Crown and the good of the sport.
00:26:21But I'm not sure, and it's horse racing, unfortunately, it's the state of the game.
00:26:28I'm not sure NYRA would make the change willingly.
00:26:32I think maybe the only way you would see it happen is for first racing to unilaterally
00:26:38move the Preakness and then basically force NYRA to move the Belmont Stakes at that point.
00:26:45I hope it wouldn't have to come down to that kind of conflict, that cooler heads could
00:26:50prevail and that NYRA could see that this is for the good of the sport.
00:26:54But I fear that that might be a road we would have to go down.
00:26:58Right.
00:26:59Well, speaking of Rick Strike, who passed the Preakness last year, he was back in the
00:27:03news.
00:27:04This was an unusual, odd story.
00:27:07Trainer Eric Reid resigned as the trainer of Rick Strike because he got in a dispute
00:27:12with owner Rick Dawson over a movie they're making about Eric Reid.
00:27:17And he says it's primarily about him and his father and the relationship.
00:27:21And it's just sort of a little bit about Rick Strike.
00:27:24I'm paraphrasing, maybe putting words into his mouth.
00:27:28Rick Strike, Dawson, as of Tuesday when we're taping this, has not announced yet who will
00:27:33be his new trainer.
00:27:35Just a strange story.
00:27:38Who's going to play Eric Reid in the movie?
00:27:43Produced by Peyton Manning, by the way.
00:27:45Look, we've all seen so many instances, even with good horses like Seattle Slew, where
00:27:51the trainers and the owner have a conflict, have a falling out, they don't get along for
00:27:56various reasons.
00:27:57I mean, heck, Penny Tweedy was super hard on Lucian Lauren, put so much pressure on
00:28:00it.
00:28:01She wasn't the easiest in the world to deal with.
00:28:03But this is something new.
00:28:05I mean, this is like next level craziness.
00:28:09I mean, I don't know if you have a better idea about this, Zoe, but I got no clue what's
00:28:13going on here.
00:28:14I have Trump plan.
00:28:15No, I've got no idea.
00:28:18They'll figure it out.
00:28:20And I like Eric.
00:28:21Eric's a good guy.
00:28:22I don't know.
00:28:23I can't think of anyone that...
00:28:26Oh, I'm sure we'll come up with someone with the plan.
00:28:28You would probably say Brent.
00:28:31Brent, there you go.
00:28:33Or Tom Cruise.
00:28:34How about that?
00:28:35Yeah.
00:28:36Yeah.
00:28:37Kind of a silly story in the middle of all the controversy that's going on in racing.
00:28:42And we'll find out what goes on with that as we progress.
00:28:47Want to remind you again about what's going on with the Penn Mile.
00:28:51And we are just 16 days away from the Grade 2, $400,000 Penn Mile at Penn National.
00:28:57The Penn Mile Day features five stakes races with almost a million dollars in purses.
00:29:03Nominations close Wednesday, but right now, some of the horses considering the race include
00:29:07Moe Stash, trained by Vicky Oliver, is the winner of the Grade 3 Transylvania at Keeneland,
00:29:12fourth in the 2022 Reader's Cup Juvenile Curve.
00:29:15How about Web Slinger, owned by our old friend John Green?
00:29:19John Green and his family, Len, of course.
00:29:21Winner of the Grade 2 American Turf at Churchill Downs, third in the Transylvania.
00:29:25And Naja Rock, I hope I'm pronouncing that right, trained by Graham Motion, second in
00:29:29the Transylvania, third in the 2022 Reader's Cup Juvenile Turf.
00:29:33Winner of the Grade 3 Futurity at Belmont at Aqueduct.
00:29:36Also, Mike Maker is considering several horses for the race.
00:29:39You can't run a good turf race without Mike Maker.
00:29:42Pennsylvania stalwart Guadalupe Preciado has three ready for the Pennsylvania bred stakes
00:29:46on the undercard, including four De Sombra in the new start stakes.
00:29:50This race is named in honor of Penn National Aftercare Homing Program, funded by the Pennsylvania
00:29:55HBPA, which has rehomed over 1,000 horses from Penn National into second careers.
00:30:032023 marks the 10th celebration of Penn National's signature event,
00:30:07Penn Mile Night, Friday, June 2nd at Hollywood Casino at Penn National Racecourse.
00:30:13There are four Pennsylvania bred stakes, each with a $100,000 purse, plus the $150,000 Penn O's.
00:30:20It's all capped off by the $400,000 Grade 2 Penn Mile, Friday, June 2nd at Penn National.
00:30:27First post, 5 p.m. For more, go to pahpba.com.
00:30:33The PA Horse Breeders Association presents the Pennsylvania Stallion Series.
00:30:38Six races for PA sire, PA bred two-year-olds at parks.
00:30:42Two $100,000 contests at 5 1⁄2 furlongs on August 21st, PA Day at the Races.
00:30:48September 23rd, PA Derby Day, as two races at 6 1⁄2 furlongs, both with a $150,000 purse.
00:30:56And in December, two races going long, each worth $200,000.
00:31:00For more, go to pabred.com.
00:31:03So, on the topic of Pennsylvania, let's talk about Pennsylvania breds.
00:31:08This podcast, TVN Podcast, is also brought to you by the Pennsylvania Horse Breeders Association, the PHBA.
00:31:16We've been talking over the last few weeks about the Pennsylvania bred Angel of Empire, leading up to the Kentucky Derby.
00:31:22And of course, he ran exceptionally well to finish third in the Derby, maybe going fastest of all at the finish.
00:31:29Good effort for that Pennsylvania bred.
00:31:31Now, we've got another PA bred in the Preakness.
00:31:33He'll be a lot bigger prize than Angel of Empire, Chase the Chaos, trained by Ed Mojer Jr.
00:31:39He's going to have to bounce back from a couple of dull efforts in his most recent races, and he'll be the longest shot on the board.
00:31:45But a Pennsylvania bred in with a shot again, Chase the Chaos in the Preakness State, spread in Pennsylvania.
00:31:54The Fastest Horse of the Week, brought to you by the Fast Stallions at Windstar Farm.
00:31:59Like this sire, who at one point was named a TVN Rising Star after he won at Saratoga.
00:32:05By 11 and a half lengths, we'll identify that stallion at Windstar shortly.
00:32:11But first, Fastest Horse of the Week, Drumroll please.
00:32:14Dr. Schivel, who won the allowance race on Saturday, right before the San Luis Rey at Santa Anita.
00:32:20It was only a three-horse field, 500 scratch down to three.
00:32:23But Dr. Schivel outran a pretty nice old pro in CZ Rocket, went essentially wire to wire, and earned a fire speed figure of 105.
00:32:33It was the first start for Dr. Schivel since he ran at Maidan in the Dubai Golden Shaheen of 2022, not 2023.
00:32:45He finished pretty good in that race. He finished third.
00:32:47Remember earlier in the Breeders' Cup sprint before that, he was beating just a nose in the sprint.
00:32:53So, a very, very talented sprinter. He was out because of bone bruising, but he bounced back in a big way to earn the Fastest Horse of the Week mantle with that 105 fire figure.
00:33:05We'll see where they wind up running Dr. Schivel next.
00:33:09Now, that Kentucky bred that we were talking about, standing stud at Windstar Farm, happens to be Nashville.
00:33:18Nashville would live up to that rising star tag by dominating the field of Keeneland in an allowance race in the second start.
00:33:24He ran the fastest six furlongs of the 2020 Keeneland meet. That was the COVID meet.
00:33:29He won a race at Oakland also in 108.61 for six furlongs, which was the fastest time at that track in two years.
00:33:37Remember that race on the Breeders' Cup undercard? It was a full second faster at six furlongs than the Breeders' Cup sprint wound up being run in.
00:33:46It's Nashville. Speed, speed, speed. Standing at Windstar for a fee of $15,000.
00:33:56If you don't know by now, you should know. The Green Group is an accounting and tax consulting advisory firm.
00:34:03They specialize in the thoroughbred business. No one wants to pay more taxes than they have to pay.
00:34:08That's what makes the Green Group so good. For more information about the Green Group and to see how they can save you money.
00:34:15I sound like Jim McAville. Save you money. Log on to www.Brewco.com.
00:34:23And welcoming now the Green Group guests of the week, the legendary Pierre Balak.
00:34:27You know him as Peb, a longtime cartoonist for the Daily Racing Forum and his son, Remy Balak, who is the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
00:34:36A very good cartoonist in his own right. And he has been doing cartoons for the Thoroughbred Daily News, normally found every Friday in our publication.
00:34:45Here's what we're going to do. We're going to have a cartoon off. What is a cartoon off?
00:34:50We're going to match the legendary Peb with his son, Remy. We're going to give them a subject.
00:34:56They're each going to do a cartoon and then we're going to have the listeners and viewers of the TDN Writers Room decide whose was better.
00:35:05Matter of fact, if you are picked, you'll get the original cartoon.
00:35:09When we're done with the interview, we'll give you all the details how to enter the contest.
00:35:14But this is quite a delight to have both of the Balak cartoonists here on the Thoroughbred Daily News podcast.
00:35:21And Peb, let's start with you going back to your history in this country.
00:35:26You came over here in 1954 at the bequest of John D. Shapiro to do cartoons for the Washington, D.C. International, which was a huge event back then.
00:35:36Can you tell us a little bit about that history and how you went from being in France to ultimately coming to Washington, D.C., to Laurel and then becoming an American cartoonist?
00:35:46Mr. Shapiro wanted me to come to visit.
00:35:52It was because of the Washington, D.C. International.
00:35:57That was the big race that was just starting the first year of that race.
00:36:05So they invited me to come to America.
00:36:08But they were wondering how I could bring me here.
00:36:13What I found, I found that a friend of mine had a place in a cargo with four horses that was coming for the Washington, D.C. International.
00:36:27So they said, if you want, you can take advantage of that thing.
00:36:34So I went to look on this cargo.
00:36:38And I, you know, I was on a bale of hay in a cargo with the four horses.
00:36:50And this is where I come to America.
00:36:53It was absolutely wonderful.
00:36:56You know, I end up in, I forgot when we end up.
00:37:03Anyway, we came this way.
00:37:06As a young boy showing up, what did you think of America as a young boy just landing fresh off the boat, flying, coming over the horses?
00:37:17What did you think?
00:37:18On the plane.
00:37:20I was overwhelmed by everything.
00:37:23Absolutely.
00:37:24And I was trying to struggle with my English.
00:37:32So that was something because I had a teacher of English.
00:37:38My mother took care of me when I was 11.
00:37:43She put me in the hand of a mademoiselle, it was a miss, Miss Courjon.
00:37:51Miss Courjon.
00:37:52I said, Miss Courjon, she's the one that taught me how to speak English.
00:37:57And when I, the first time I came back to Maison Lafitte, what do I see in the street?
00:38:04Mademoiselle Courjon.
00:38:06So I was so proud of my English.
00:38:10So I said to Mademoiselle Courjon, hey, how are you?
00:38:13How is everything?
00:38:15I wanted to show off.
00:38:17And she became red.
00:38:20She blushed and she couldn't speak, you know.
00:38:26I was so sorry because I wanted to show off my English, you know, to her.
00:38:32Mademoiselle Courjon, I forgot.
00:38:36It was a lovely, lovely memory.
00:38:40Now, Remy, my question for you is not only are you very good at this as well, your style is very similar to your father's.
00:38:47In fact, if you put the two cartoons together, I don't think people could tell who was who, which is Remy and which is Peb.
00:38:54Did this all just come naturally or is this the result of your father sitting you down as a student teaching you how to do this?
00:39:01Well, I think, first of all, thank you.
00:39:04That's a great compliment, you know.
00:39:06And the answer to that question is my father always said, listen, you're going to develop the style over time.
00:39:12The drawings that he drew in the early 50s were completely different than the drawings he's done lately.
00:39:19And it's the same thing with artwork.
00:39:23There's not a thousand different ways to draw, you know, funny horses with big bulgy eyes.
00:39:30I have to start somewhere and hopefully it kind of develops into its own style.
00:39:37I think it's also the type of humor you use.
00:39:40And so I've had a lot of influences of other cartoonists when I did political cartoons and things like that.
00:39:47It was a whole different realm.
00:39:50When it comes to equine related cartoons, though, it's hard to kind of get completely away from it.
00:39:57But hopefully I can kind of build a style, not just in the artwork, but in the humor.
00:40:04I think probably, well, listen, it's like having Rodney Dangerfield or Jerry Seinfeld as your father.
00:40:13It's hard to top that kind of humor.
00:40:15His cartoons were funny in the 70s and are still funny today.
00:40:21Mine might be more topical to what's happening currently in racing.
00:40:25And so, you know, it's kind of really...
00:40:32I do get a little bit of influence from a guy named Gary Larson, who used to do The Far Side.
00:40:38I loved his work, too.
00:40:40So I try to kind of blend things a little bit.
00:40:43And then eventually I hope to have a completely unique style.
00:40:47Well, guys, I should have said this right from the start.
00:40:50It is an absolute pleasure to meet the pair of you on screen at the same time.
00:40:56Remy, I've been a fan of yours, Peb, when I first got off my plane from England.
00:41:01One of the first few things I saw in the Daily Racing Forum was a Peb cartoon.
00:41:06And I'm like, this is amazing.
00:41:08So I bow down to the pair of you.
00:41:12But Peb, how did this all start?
00:41:15How did you start cartooning?
00:41:17Well, I always tried to copy from the newspapers when I was a kid, you know.
00:41:25I was copying cartoons.
00:41:28And that was my, you know, my ambition to draw.
00:41:34I made albums of caricature of politicians.
00:41:41I got albums full of those things, you know.
00:41:45And I had a great passion for that.
00:41:49As a matter of fact, my father was a head lad in a stable
00:41:58where we had the little stable in the back.
00:42:03And my mother and my family was living above the horses in the kitchen.
00:42:10You know, we were living right above the row of horses.
00:42:17And so, on summer, I would put my table outside
00:42:27and I would start drawing all kind of...
00:42:30I drew a series of sketches that, you know, I was like 12, something like that.
00:42:37But I was drawing a race from start to finish with all the sequences.
00:42:46And I still had that for a long time.
00:42:49So there was the start, there was during the race,
00:42:53and there was the finish, and there was the coming back from, you know, the whole thing.
00:42:59So that took me the whole summer, sitting down outside and drawing those things.
00:43:08So that, you know, that was my passion to do that.
00:43:14My father, in the meantime, he was working here in the same area, you know.
00:43:20And my father was, he was cute because he was trying to get us some food.
00:43:27And what he got, he got traps for birds that he put in a...
00:43:36in a...
00:43:39In a manure pit.
00:43:42So he had those traps in the manure things.
00:43:47And then, at the end of the day, there was about six or seven,
00:43:53eight birds that was caught in the manure.
00:43:59So he would gather that thing with those birds.
00:44:03And my mother upstairs, she had to pluck the birds.
00:44:09And she was roasting the birds for us to feed because we...
00:44:15They were delicious.
00:44:17You have no idea.
00:44:20To me, you give me a turkey, I don't give a damn about the turkey.
00:44:25But those birds, my goodness, they were so good.
00:44:28You could eat everything, you know.
00:44:32So that was the occupation of my father to feed us and to make sure that we had...
00:44:43My father was a great guy, you know.
00:44:46He was cutting trees in the park.
00:44:49Wow.
00:44:50Where you could get caught and he would...
00:44:53And he put the piece of...
00:44:56He would put the piece of tree under the leaves and bringing one piece every night on his bicycle.
00:45:05Oh, my gosh.
00:45:06It was something.
00:45:08We survived and thanks to...
00:45:10But the taste of those birds, you have no idea how delicious they were.
00:45:16Sounds delicious.
00:45:18Pab, when most people think of cartoonists, they think of political cartoonists.
00:45:23And I understand at one point in your career, you worked for Walter Annenberg,
00:45:27who owned both the Racing Forum and the Philadelphia Inquirer,
00:45:30and he wanted you to give up racing to become a political cartoonist full time.
00:45:34And you said no.
00:45:35Tell us about that story and why.
00:45:37I didn't say no.
00:45:39I said I cannot leave the racing cartoon.
00:45:45I want to do both, you know.
00:45:47I think one of the things, too, is the paper soon got sold from Annenberg, I think, to Knight Ritter.
00:45:53And so I think at that point you had to make a decision to go for one or the other.
00:46:00And I want to point out that had my father decided to stay with the Philadelphia Inquirer with Knight Ritter,
00:46:08he'd probably have a wall full of Pulitzers at this point.
00:46:12A lot of other cartoonists have said so.
00:46:15And that might have been the loss of the political world, but our gain, certainly, in horse racing.
00:46:24Absolutely.
00:46:25I'm glad you didn't leave.
00:46:27And you got into the Hall of Fame last year.
00:46:30You were on the Joe Hirsch Honor Roll.
00:46:32And I know a lot of journalists out there and a lot of people that just type and write
00:46:36are just itching to get in there.
00:46:38But you were inducted last year.
00:46:40How was that?
00:46:41That's pretty amazing.
00:46:42Because I paid him under the table.
00:46:47You paid the right person.
00:46:51I gave him, you know, a few thousand dollars.
00:46:56No, I don't know.
00:46:58I don't know how to answer that question.
00:47:01It's quite an honor, though.
00:47:04I think it's another fun fact is that, correct me if I'm wrong,
00:47:08but you actually started at the Morning Telegraph before Joe Hirsch, didn't you?
00:47:16Yeah.
00:47:18You know, you mentioned Joe Hirsch.
00:47:23I don't know if you see a caricature that did of Joe Hirsch.
00:47:27No.
00:47:28He was really a caricature.
00:47:31He was really a caricature.
00:47:33He was a good guy.
00:47:34He was so good, you know.
00:47:35But he was so – he was like a pope, you know, like a pope.
00:47:41I saw that he was like a pope, you know.
00:47:44He had a little bit – you know, he could be a pope, by the way,
00:47:48because he was hunched like that.
00:47:53Maybe the wrong religion, but nonetheless.
00:47:59Let me also jump in.
00:48:01I think it's important for a lot of the viewers to know that one of the things
00:48:05that makes my father unique is the art of caricature,
00:48:10which now I want to make sure, you know,
00:48:13people know that there are those caricaturists you might see at a party
00:48:17or at the shopping mall with the big head and the small body type of thing.
00:48:22But the art of caricature, the style my father adopted back in his youth,
00:48:28which you might see the famous cartoonist like Sem, S-E-M,
00:48:33who did a lot of sporting art kind of caricatures,
00:48:37that's pretty unique because it's not – so the way to show you how good he is
00:48:45as a caricaturist is that there are some people that my dad will draw,
00:48:50like when he drew Borrello Baeza as a jockey.
00:48:53And if you look at the drawing and you cover up the face of the jockey,
00:48:57you still know who it is just by the posture.
00:49:00And I think it was one of the great things of growing up is that my father would say,
00:49:06you know, we'd be at Belmont or at Aqueduct.
00:49:09And he would say to me, you know, there's a lot of very powerful people here,
00:49:14you know, Whitney's and Vanderbilt's and all that,
00:49:17but I'm the most powerful person here.
00:49:19And I'd say, why?
00:49:20I said, because I can make any one of these people stand up and run away.
00:49:23And I'd say, show me.
00:49:25And he would walk up with his pad and his pencil,
00:49:28and he would fake drawing, you know, one of the –
00:49:33and then she would get up and she would run away into the grass
00:49:38and not have a caricature.
00:49:39And he says, see?
00:49:43So, Pat, on that subject, who are some of the favorite horses or people?
00:49:47Who did you just love to draw over the years?
00:49:50Love to draw.
00:49:52You know, there is so many.
00:49:54I don't know if I can answer that because, to me,
00:49:58I think it was fantastic to be given the gift of caricaturing people, you know.
00:50:07And I never – I always try not to be mean with my caricature,
00:50:15except for a few guys that I can stand, but only a few.
00:50:21But usually try to get something out of the face that was funny,
00:50:30but also there was some kind of gentleness about it, you know.
00:50:37I never wanted to be rude with people, except for a few women.
00:50:46Can we ask?
00:50:48I think Zoe wants to know who those women were.
00:50:51Women? Yes. Exactly. Who was it?
00:50:56No, I don't want to say that.
00:50:58Good choice. Good choice.
00:51:02So, I'll tell you what.
00:51:03My favorite cartoon that my father has done is actually,
00:51:07if you can see right over my shoulder right there,
00:51:10he gave this to me a couple of years ago.
00:51:12And maybe I'll do a screenshot of it and send it to you guys.
00:51:16It's a caricature of Muhammad Ali that my father did on the back of a menu
00:51:22at a sports banquet in New York in 1966,
00:51:26where he fought Sonny Liston.
00:51:28And it's signed by Ali, who notoriously would never sign anything.
00:51:34But he saw the drawing and he said, that's good.
00:51:37And so, that's like my prized possession right there.
00:51:43You have that, yeah.
00:51:44Yeah, I stole it from you.
00:51:45You know, you didn't know, but I know.
00:51:47Oh.
00:51:49You gave it to me.
00:51:52Bill, to your question, I think one of the important things too,
00:51:56having worked in different facets of the industry over many years,
00:52:01it's so important that whether you're a trainer, a writer, a jockey,
00:52:08or you work as a journalist or management,
00:52:13I always tell a lot of the students that I teach at our community college,
00:52:17our equine studies program, always have an outlet
00:52:22and also always keep a bit of a sense of humor
00:52:26because oftentimes we get caught up in a lot of the important issues
00:52:33of our sport and our industry.
00:52:35But if you can't once in a while kind of take a step back
00:52:38and have a chuckle now and then,
00:52:41well, you know, you're not going to last for a very long time.
00:52:45Or if you do, you're not going to be very happy.
00:52:47Right.
00:52:48And I think that's an important thing that my father has been bringing
00:52:52to the industry for quite a long time and in whatever capacity now
00:52:58that I'm done shutting down racetracks.
00:53:01I'm like a cautionary tale.
00:53:03Bill and I go back to the Garden State days.
00:53:06You know, people at these conventions, they run away from me
00:53:10because I'm like Chief Dark Cloud.
00:53:12It's like Garden State, Hollywood Park, Long Acres.
00:53:16So now I'm in a safe industry.
00:53:20I can't shut down any more racetracks.
00:53:22But it's important.
00:53:24I'm glad I can, you know, bring a little bit of levity
00:53:29and sometimes an important point that people need to look at.
00:53:33All right.
00:53:34So let's explain how this Balak versus Balak cartoon off is going to work.
00:53:39So what we're going to do is we're going to do time lapse videos
00:53:42of the drawings that Remy and Peb did.
00:53:44We gave them a specific subject they both have to tackle,
00:53:48which is the 50th anniversary of Secretariat's Triple Crown win.
00:53:53Perhaps it's Preakness win.
00:53:54We'll see what they come up with.
00:53:55Of course, with the anniversary of the Preakness coming up.
00:53:57So first, let's take a look at Remy's.
00:53:59And now let's take a look at Peb's.
00:54:10And to vote for your favorite and to be entered in a drawing to win that cartoon,
00:54:26go to Remy's Twitter feed, which is at Balak Remy, B-E-L-L-O-C-Q-R-E-M-I.
00:54:34Once again, Remy's Twitter feed is Balak Remy at B-E-L-L-O-C-Q-R-E-M-I.
00:54:42Follow him.
00:54:43You have to be a follower to win the drawing.
00:54:45Vote on the Twitter poll for the drawing you like best.
00:54:49The results will be announced on next week's show.
00:54:52And if your name is chosen, you will be given the original drawing won by the winner.
00:54:59So this has been a delightful conversation among everybody.
00:55:03Zoe, you got something you want to add to it?
00:55:05Can I answer?
00:55:08Of course you can.
00:55:09No, I don't think so.
00:55:10No.
00:55:11Friends and family in the TDN Writer's Room are not eligible.
00:55:14Isn't that what they always say on these sort of things?
00:55:16So you're not eligible.
00:55:18Your family's not eligible.
00:55:19I'm not eligible.
00:55:20We're going to have Joe Phan win this.
00:55:22So maybe you can do a side deal with Pev and Remy for something like that.
00:55:27I'm planning on it.
00:55:28So anyways, Mr. and Mr. Balak, it's been delightful.
00:55:31Thank you so much for being our guest, the Green Group Guest of the Week.
00:55:35But if Remy wins, I kill myself.
00:55:40Now, now, now.
00:55:41Don't do that.
00:55:44Okay, take it easy on the old man, would you, Remy?
00:55:47Once again, thanks so much for joining us.
00:55:49Thank you all.
00:55:50Appreciate it.
00:55:52As this week's Guests of the Week, Remy and Pierre Balak,
00:55:56will receive each a free one-hour tax consultation from the Green Group,
00:56:02hoping to save them money on their taxes.
00:56:05For more information, log on to www.greenco.com.
00:56:10Are you paying too much in taxes?
00:56:12The Green Group can help.
00:56:14There's a reason the most successful owners, breeders, and horsemen
00:56:17select the Green Group as their tax advisors.
00:56:20They save you money and share successful strategies.
00:56:24Over the past 40 years, the Green Group founder, Len Green,
00:56:27has owned and bred some of the best racehorses in the history of the sport,
00:56:32like Eclipse Award-winning champions Jay Walk and Wonder Wheel.
00:56:35His DJ stable competes at the highest level
00:56:38and has received the game's most prestigious honors.
00:56:41Len Green's in-depth, hands-on industry knowledge,
00:56:44combined with cutting-edge tax-saving strategies,
00:56:47has produced positive results for his clientele
00:56:50and has made the Green Group the top-rated accounting and tax firm
00:56:53in the thoroughbred business.
00:56:55For a confidential and complimentary consultation,
00:56:58contact us at 732-634-5100
00:57:02or visit our website at www.greenco.com.
00:57:07Green Group, proven strategies to save you taxes.
00:57:11With some of the fullest fields in the country
00:57:14and quality racing year-round,
00:57:16there's never been a better time to reap the rewards
00:57:19of breeding and racing in Kentucky.
00:57:23Purse money in Kentucky is at an all-time high,
00:57:26as is average purse per race,
00:57:28outpacing California, Florida, and New York.
00:57:33Breed them. Raise them. Race them.
00:57:36We all win.
00:57:41TV and Writer's Room is brought to you by Kentucky Breads.
00:57:45The average purse per race in Kentucky.
00:57:48$77,126.
00:57:51Average.
00:57:53Outpacing all leading racing jurisdictions, including Arkansas.
00:57:56We know the pots there have been crazy good.
00:57:58New York, California, and Florida.
00:58:00Additionally, over $200 million
00:58:03has been distributed to Kentucky breeders since 2006
00:58:06with purse money soaring.
00:58:08And thanks to the Kentucky Thoroughbred Development Fund,
00:58:10some of the fullest fields in the country
00:58:13with quality racing year-round has been taking place in Kentucky.
00:58:16There is no better time to breed and race in the bluegrass.
00:58:20And as the Triple Crown season continues,
00:58:23all eyes here in Baltimore will be on the Kentucky-bred maize,
00:58:28obviously winner of the Kentucky Derby first Saturday in May
00:58:31as he seeks to add the Preakness and go on to the Belmont Six
00:58:34with a chance to sweep the Triple Crown.
00:58:36Kentucky breads have won a total of 103 runnings
00:58:41of the Preakness, including eight in a row
00:58:43and six of the eight this year bred in Kentucky.
00:58:48I think I speak for Randy and Zoe when I said,
00:58:50wouldn't you like to get through a podcast
00:58:52without having to do some bad news?
00:58:54And unfortunately, you know, we try to cover all the subjects.
00:58:57And once again, there was some bad news for horse racing.
00:59:00As everyone knows, Forte tested positive
00:59:04for a therapeutic medication called meloxicam
00:59:08after the hopeful last year.
00:59:10It didn't come out until it was leaked to the New York Times,
00:59:13which reported on it last week.
00:59:15And then shortly thereafter, there was finally some word
00:59:18from the New York Gaming Commission about what was going on here.
00:59:21There's a couple of different subjects here that I want to tackle.
00:59:23I'll just throw two out.
00:59:25First of all, the fact that it took eight months
00:59:28for this to be made public, to come out,
00:59:31and both sides have blamed one another.
00:59:33A lot of finger pointing here.
00:59:34I don't care who's at fault.
00:59:36I don't know who's at fault.
00:59:38It's inexcusable.
00:59:40And, you know, one thing I've said,
00:59:42you know, imagine going back to baseball.
00:59:44Imagine if Mike Trout or Shohei Ohtani
00:59:48tested positive for steroids today
00:59:50and the Major League Baseball announces it
00:59:52first time in the middle of next season.
00:59:54They'd be a laughingstock.
00:59:56And this is absolutely what happened here.
00:59:59Haise said when they come in, it's going to be different.
01:00:02These things are going to be adjudicated much more frequently.
01:00:06The other thing, too, and, you know,
01:00:08I hate to bash fellow journalists,
01:00:10and people may or may not know,
01:00:12I'm a northeastern liberal left wing guy.
01:00:16And I love the New York Times.
01:00:18Really? You are? I never knew that.
01:00:20Price is you? Oh, my God.
01:00:22I think Bernie Sanders is you, right, Wayne?
01:00:25Anyway, but we've got a problem here.
01:00:28And here's the headline for the story.
01:00:32Trainer of one-time derby favorite
01:00:34is disciplined in doping case.
01:00:37No, it was not a doping case.
01:00:39That is something they accused the New York Post
01:00:42or the National Enquirer of doing,
01:00:44sensationalizing the facts.
01:00:46Now, it's not good that this happened.
01:00:48Nobody wanted to see it happen.
01:00:50But, you know, people inside racing
01:00:52understand what's going on here,
01:00:53and it shouldn't have happened.
01:00:54I don't know what happened here.
01:00:56Pletcher says it's environmental contamination.
01:00:59He said he never, this drug was never in his barn,
01:01:02never prescribed.
01:01:04But this is really bad journalism.
01:01:07And it's unfortunate because
01:01:09everyone else picks up on this.
01:01:11And this is the last thing horse racing needs.
01:01:13And they went back to it.
01:01:15They went, you know, a couple paragraphs.
01:01:17Doping and horse deaths have long plagued racing.
01:01:20Yes, they have, but this was not a horse death.
01:01:23This was not doping.
01:01:25You know, so anyways, you know, it's not good.
01:01:29And, you know, Miranda, you're a journalist
01:01:32in your writing days.
01:01:33And, you know, there's certain standards
01:01:34that you should, everyone should live up to.
01:01:37And, you know, they twist this around
01:01:40and sensationalize in it.
01:01:41And I don't want to make excuses for horse racing
01:01:44because there's too many problems
01:01:45and damn it, these things shouldn't happen
01:01:47in the first place.
01:01:48But I don't like the coverage of it.
01:01:51If I was still in the newspaper business
01:01:53and they wrote a headline about Forte
01:01:57saying that, you know, Derby favorite doped,
01:02:01I would probably show up at the newspaper office
01:02:03with a torch.
01:02:05It's just ridiculous that that happens.
01:02:09Medina Spirit wasn't doped.
01:02:11Forte wasn't doped.
01:02:14It's a legal therapeutic medication
01:02:17that was, that had, you know,
01:02:20obviously too much of it was in Forte's system
01:02:23when he won the hopeful.
01:02:24That's a far cry from doping
01:02:26trying to gain an advantage.
01:02:28Maybe I'm gullible.
01:02:29I think Todd Pletcher's a standup guy.
01:02:33I think if he had given the medication to Forte
01:02:36and just too much remained in his system,
01:02:40he would admit that.
01:02:41I mean, he comes out and just flat out says,
01:02:43we never gave this to Forte.
01:02:47Now, obviously the split sample, you know,
01:02:50he was in a system, how it got in a system,
01:02:53what kind of contamination, who knows?
01:02:55But it does, it gives her a single black eye.
01:02:57But the biggest problem here, as you pointed out,
01:02:59it's not, is it Pletcher's lawyers
01:03:04that were causing the problem?
01:03:06Is it New York authorities
01:03:07that were causing the problem?
01:03:08It's the system that allows this
01:03:12to linger and to fester for all this time
01:03:15in the shadows as if they're trying to hide something
01:03:19with zero transparency.
01:03:22And it has to come out eventually
01:03:25in a New York Times article by Joe Drake.
01:03:27It's ridiculous.
01:03:28And I mean, HISA immediately jumped forward
01:03:32and showed the regulations
01:03:35that it will bring to the table
01:03:36if it's allowed to May 22nd.
01:03:38It's looking encouraging, but it has before.
01:03:40When the medication thing kicks in for ISA,
01:03:42where this would not happen,
01:03:44I think they have a 30 day threshold
01:03:46or something like that
01:03:47to where it would have to be adjudicated.
01:03:49And there would be a provisional suspension
01:03:51for a trainer with a positive test right away.
01:03:54That's, it's the way it ought to be.
01:03:57And that day, in my opinion,
01:04:01given what happened with Justify
01:04:03and the scopolamine positive
01:04:05and what happened to Forte now,
01:04:06it can't come soon enough.
01:04:07Yeah.
01:04:08I mean, that's just sensationalizing the lead
01:04:11and whoever wrote that headline
01:04:13should just be shot, basically.
01:04:17We don't need any of that.
01:04:20And Todd Pletcher and the lawyers and everyone,
01:04:23they're all fighting over everything.
01:04:25They're probably going to continue to do it.
01:04:27But at the end of the day,
01:04:28what we're talking about is contamination.
01:04:30This is the biggest subject,
01:04:32nevermind the headlines
01:04:33that horse racing has to tackle.
01:04:36Where do you draw the line
01:04:37between contamination and something else?
01:04:39500 picograms.
01:04:41A picogram is a trillionth of a gram.
01:04:45It's absolutely nothing.
01:04:46It's inconsequential.
01:04:48We need to have a threshold
01:04:51that horses can be okay with.
01:04:54Because I think Todd did his due diligence
01:04:57and went through his whole barn
01:04:59and see if anyone was using
01:05:01that type of anti-inflammatory medication
01:05:04and went look for it.
01:05:06And it's like,
01:05:07we've never given the horse that.
01:05:08And Todd is,
01:05:09he runs a very, very tight ship.
01:05:12And guys that run tight ships
01:05:14don't give the wrong kind of drugs.
01:05:16Now, do they push the envelope?
01:05:17Sure, they push the envelope.
01:05:19But if there's no envelope to be pushed,
01:05:21there's nothing to be pushed.
01:05:23So we need to do a better job with everything.
01:05:27And we need some journalists
01:05:30in the New York Times
01:05:31that like horse racing
01:05:32is what I really want right now
01:05:34to be perfectly honest.
01:05:36So yeah, I'm gonna disagree with you
01:05:38because it's not a journalist's job
01:05:39to like horse racing.
01:05:41Correct.
01:05:42That's the people in the industry,
01:05:45the executives.
01:05:47But it's a journalist's job
01:05:49to get the facts right
01:05:51and to write a credible story.
01:05:53So journalist's job
01:05:55is not to promote horse racing.
01:05:57If somebody writes a negative story
01:05:59about horse racing
01:06:00and they get the facts right,
01:06:02and I don't think they have an agenda.
01:06:04I have no problem with that.
01:06:05I've done that myself 10,000 times.
01:06:08So, you know, that would be my point on that.
01:06:10But, you know, again,
01:06:11it's just back to what Randy said.
01:06:14You know, the eight months thing,
01:06:16I just, I don't know what to do,
01:06:17but shake my head.
01:06:18And hopefully Haise will correct this
01:06:21and it's not gonna happen in 72 hours
01:06:23or 48 hours,
01:06:24but they promise they're putting an end
01:06:26to this sort of stuff.
01:06:27And that is a change that is needed.
01:06:29That is a change that is very badly needed.
01:06:32All right.
01:06:33Let's get on to the nicer subjects.
01:06:35Zoe, who's the XBTV work?
01:06:38Well, the XBTV Work of the Week
01:06:40is Fraser,
01:06:41seen working here
01:06:42for Hall of Fame of Bob Baffert.
01:06:43And she broke off about 10 lengths
01:06:45behind her company
01:06:47and just absolutely cruised along.
01:06:49I told you earlier
01:06:50about how the last race to Santa Anita Oaks
01:06:52had definitely pricked up her ears.
01:06:54Well, here she is.
01:06:55She starts drawing off
01:06:57from her workmate there.
01:06:58The horse, incidentally,
01:06:59who comes up beside her
01:07:00is a Mark Blatt trainee
01:07:01by the name of Agency,
01:07:03who was Bolt Dorough's
01:07:04very first two-year-old winner.
01:07:06He's on the comeback trail
01:07:08and is a very, very nice
01:07:09three-year-old colt.
01:07:11So Fraser more than holding her own
01:07:13in the morning now
01:07:14as well as the afternoon
01:07:16because before watching her work,
01:07:17she was just a horse.
01:07:19The XBTV Workout of the Week
01:07:21is Fraser.
01:07:22We'll be right back
01:07:23after these messages.
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01:08:12make new friends,
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01:08:15of thoroughbred racing.
01:08:16♪♪
01:08:18West Point Thoroughbreds,
01:08:20the gold standard
01:08:21in racing partnerships.
01:08:22Visit westpointtb.com.
01:08:26The TDN Writers' Room
01:08:27is brought to you by
01:08:28West Point Thoroughbreds,
01:08:29seen right here.
01:08:30Joining a West Point Thoroughbred
01:08:31partnership can vault you
01:08:33literally right into
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01:08:38on your own.
01:08:39Jace's Road may not
01:08:41have given West Point
01:08:42another Kentucky Derby,
01:08:44but they had two very promising
01:08:46allowance winners in the week.
01:08:48Randy, what can you tell me
01:08:49about Vava?
01:08:50Looks like she's pointing
01:08:51to the test for her next start
01:08:54Yeah, they gave Vava a chance
01:08:56at the fairgrounds
01:08:57to be a Kentucky Oaks-type filly.
01:08:59They ran her in the untappable,
01:09:01then they ran her in the
01:09:02Rachel Alexandra.
01:09:03She caught pretty mischievous
01:09:04both times and was well-beaten
01:09:06like a filly that just didn't
01:09:07want to go around two turns.
01:09:09So they backed her up
01:09:10in distance.
01:09:11She had a nice six-and-a-half
01:09:12furlong allowance race
01:09:13at Keeneland,
01:09:14finishing second
01:09:15to Positano Sunset
01:09:16in a really fast race,
01:09:17and then came back
01:09:18on the Oaks undercard
01:09:19and won that allowance race
01:09:20really impressively
01:09:22with an 85 by her speed figure.
01:09:24So in a year in which
01:09:25three-year-old fillies
01:09:27look to be among the weaker
01:09:29of the divisions,
01:09:31I think you'd have to give Vava
01:09:32a really close look
01:09:34when she comes back
01:09:35to Saratoga in the test.
01:09:36And not only did they have Vava,
01:09:38Giant Game was grade one place
01:09:40in the Breeders' Cup Juvenile
01:09:41in 2021,
01:09:43and is rounding back to form
01:09:44at age four.
01:09:46He set all the pace
01:09:47in a Thursday allowance race
01:09:48to win for trainer Dale Romans.
01:09:50To learn more,
01:09:51visit westpointtv.com.
01:09:54All right, guys,
01:09:55that's a wrap for this week's
01:09:56Pregnus edition
01:09:57of the Thoroughbred Daily News podcast.
01:09:58I want to thank my cohorts,
01:10:00Zoe Cadman and Randy Moss,
01:10:02taking some time out
01:10:03from their busy week
01:10:04at Pimlico for the Pregnus.
01:10:06Our Green Group guests of the week,
01:10:07Remy and Pierre Balak.
01:10:09Pierre Balak, of course,
01:10:10better known as Pev.
01:10:12Our assistant and associate producers,
01:10:14Katie Petruniak and Anthony LaRocca,
01:10:16as well as our editors,
01:10:18Leah LaRocca and Nathan Wilkinson.
01:10:20Enjoy the Pregnus, everybody.
01:10:21We'll talk to you next week.