Catch up on all the latest news from across Kent with Gabriel Morris, joined by Rich Lehman a Green councillor from Swale council and the Chief Executive of the Kent Science Park.
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00:00Hello and welcome to the Kent Politics Show, live here on KMTV.
00:29I'm Gabriel Morris. This week, a planning inquiry is underway into one of the biggest
00:33developments ever proposed for Kent. Hyster Park would see more than 8,000 homes built
00:38on farmland, a new motorway junction and a relief road to Sittingbourne. It's proven
00:43to be incredibly controversial, but the developers and many businesses say it'll promote growth
00:48in the local area. I'll be joined on the sofa by the Chief Executive of the Kent Science
00:52Park and local Green Councillor, Rich Layman. And this week, Kent County Councillors also
00:58u-turned a Cabinet decision, thought to be one of the only the second time in two years
01:03this has happened. We'll find out what's now happening to the two children's centres later
01:08in the programme. But first, let's start on that planning inquiry. It's underway, plans
01:13for more than 8,000 homes and rural land across Kent. Last year, the government called in
01:19Hyster Park, taking the decision-making away from the local council, a decision that will
01:23now ultimately be made by central government. The MP for Sittingbourne asked the Secretary
01:28of State to do this. He argues Swellborough Council were set to refuse it, so it would
01:34have likely ended up at a planning inquiry regardless. The first signs of spring blossoming
01:41in this quaint rural village. But little joy in Robinsham, as more than 8,000 homes are
01:46planned for the land around this community. A 12-week planning inquiry is starting this
01:51week into the proposals which will transform the area. The developer arguing for its economic
01:57benefits, whereas hundreds of residents fear the end of rural life. We're not just NIMBYs,
02:02we do want to make sure there's housing provision for our community. But we do think we've got
02:07a really strong chance of pushing forward what are the many ecological, landscaping
02:10and other factors that development is right, and not just right here. What would the feel
02:15of the area be? Would it still be a village? I don't think we could call it a village at
02:18all. I think one of the things we're most worried about is that we will look off into
02:21the distance of what was the shadow of Robinsham Church, and now we will see an M2 junction
02:25motorway. St Nicholas has been here since medieval times, the urban sprue of Sittingbourne
02:31getting ever closer. So we're at the top of Robinsham's Church right now. If the development
02:36does go ahead, what would we be able to see from up here? So over here would be thousands
02:42of houses all the way across the field here, all the way up to Dully. Over here would be
02:47sports facilities along with the Southern Relief Road, which weaves all around the villages here.
02:52This is not affordable housing what's being offered here. In the northern scheme, it's
02:57only about 4.5% is going to be affordable. I mean, that's outrageous. It's a huge land
03:02grab taking up huge swathes of some of our best agricultural land in the country.
03:08The development would see new schools, health centres and sports facilities,
03:12and Quinn Estates as more than 50% of the site will be publicly accessible.
03:18This is the proposed plan for Highstead Park. You can see the balance of the 8,500 homes
03:24with the country park as well in the middle. An incredibly controversial development. People
03:29living around Robinsham don't like the idea of thousands of homes around them. However,
03:34down at the south, the Science Park and businesses could get a big boost. The Brickies are having
03:40one of the best seasons yet and believe Highstead Park could help them go from strength to strength.
03:46In the 70s, we used to get good crowds and things like that, and there's signs that it's coming
03:51back. And it's a big population here now, over 60,000 in Sydenbourne. So, yeah, been fantastic.
03:57And on that, it could be about to get even bigger. Highstead Park development,
04:00going to planning inquiry. You guys are set to benefit from that, aren't you?
04:04We are very much so. We've got over 40 teams. We need a bigger footprint, bigger site.
04:09And this is going to be a school or a doctor's, I think, here. We're going to move nearer the
04:14motorway if the development goes through with a 125-year lease for the community. Not for us,
04:20just for us, but we'll run it for them, but it'll be for the community. And it will benefit because
04:25the whole of this town is so far behind with its sports. I think even the two all-weather
04:31and three grass pitches we put in at the new stadium will still be behind the requirement
04:36for the country for sports. They say the proposed relief road could greatly benefit the community
04:41and are calling for this to come first. It'll see a new junction from the M2 to Sydenbourne.
04:47The key thing about this development is those houses pay for the road. They pay for other
04:52things as well, like primary schools, secondary schools, health centre, new football club,
04:56but they actually pay for the road. And we all know the state the country's in at the moment
05:00with a lack of big infrastructure, but also how tight public finances are. Effectively,
05:06this is a great way, potentially, of using housing development to also build the infrastructure. And
05:12what really matters is we get the infrastructure first, and that's what currently is being
05:16proposed by the developers. The developer has said the new road is chronically needed in the
05:20local area, but local environmental campaigners say it's not worth it as it'll cut through this
05:27ancient woodland. No one really knows the full impact of what will happen when you do this.
05:31What we do know is it'll fragment their habitat. It means that we'll get reduced
05:36gene pool for certain species. And if we fragment them too much, those particular
05:41species will die out altogether in those in close to those areas because they haven't got enough
05:46habitat. Across the next 12 weeks, all these arguments and many more will be heard. It'll
05:52then be in the hands of the planning inspector to decide whether this land stays as it is,
05:58or if this huge development can go ahead. And if it's given the green light,
06:03it'll take two decades to complete. Gabriel Morris in Sittingbourne.
06:10Well, joining me on the sofa today is Rich Layman, a Green Councillor on Kent County Council and
06:16Swale Borough Council, and also the Chief Executive of the Kent Science Park, Richard. Richard,
06:21thank you for joining us today. I'm going to come to you first. Tell us a little bit about the
06:24science park. Who's there? What's it for? And importantly, if Hysted goes ahead, how would
06:31you benefit from that? Great to be here. Thank you for the invite. I mean, it's a fabulous scheme,
06:37fabulous asset. Before we get into the actual asset itself, or Kent Science Park, it's worth
06:43maybe sort of setting the scene about the sector. The life science sector itself is something we in
06:49the UK can be very proud of. I mean, we are often rated in second or third globally. But it is a
06:57sector that where we are constantly, we have competition nipping at our heels. The bit,
07:03though, more turning locally around Kent Science Park is actually the heritage of the science park
07:09itself is really, really strong. It's not widely common knowledge, but from work undertaken at
07:15Science Park, there's actually a Nobel Prize awarded back in the 70s around cholesterol,
07:23which led to statins, which is something that we all know and feel, or many of us know and feel.
07:29Looking forward, I mean, there's some really exciting things going on on site and actually
07:35should and could have a significant impact on the local community, not just in terms of jobs,
07:41and that's the state of the obvious, but also from a sort of wider national perspective,
07:48growing, scaling those companies, keeping them in the UK. And this is where Highestead Park enables
07:55us to really create the environment and the infrastructure that give these companies a
08:01viable choice to stay in the UK. And we have ourselves at KSP, I won't name and shame,
08:07lost a couple of companies to foreign shores, which is an absolute darn crying shame.
08:12So it might promote growth, but we're just seeing some pictures on the screen. It's
08:16going to encroach so closely to some small villages, these houses, 8,400 in total.
08:21And if the development does go ahead, it's going to impact multiple conservation areas
08:25and a triple SI. Is it all worth it for that? Any development always creates impact,
08:31unfortunately. But any development is and should be considered and reviewed with pros and cons.
08:39And if it is determined that there are more pros than cons, then I think the sort of common sense
08:46tends to prevail. Nationally, you look at what seems to be coming out of national government
08:53now, we're sort of moving into a world of common sense politics, which is actually
08:58quite heartwarming from my perspective. But ultimately, I believe common sense will prevail
09:06on Hystead Park. And there are more pros than cons. But I'm not sort of dismissing the cons
09:12by any stretch of the imagination. But there are, we can't, you know, in my view, you can't
09:18sort of negatively ignore the positives.
09:22Let's bring Rich in to this. Green Party be fiercely opposed to this since its outset.
09:27Building for H and Woodland, particularly on the Relief Road. But homes are needed in the local area.
09:32Why have you been opposing to this so much?
09:34Absolutely, homes are needed. But to give the example of Faversham, since I lived there in the 2010s,
09:42in the 2000s, moved back in the 2010s. Since then, 2000 houses have been built around the
09:48outskirts of Faversham. During that time, there have been 2000 people in Faversham in need of a
09:55home. And there are still 2000 people in need of a home because the homes being built aren't the
09:59ones to local need. Similarly, with Hystead Park, we've got a situation where 8400 houses are going
10:06to be built if the application was approved. And the majority of them will not be affordable to
10:14people living and working in Swale. The average salary in Swale is £35,000. A young couple with
10:22a 5% deposit can get a mortgage of £315,000.
10:27But wouldn't this development help promote growth in the area?
10:31It may help promote growth in the area, but it wouldn't help those people. The purpose of
10:35Labour's £1.5 million target for housing is to address an affordable housing crisis.
10:41This will do nothing to address that. Of the 74 homes available around Sittingbourne today
10:48on Rightmove that are new builds, just one would be within reach of people earning an
10:54average wage who live and work in Swale. The other 73 are outside of their price range.
11:00And the majority of houses, even the paltry amount of affordable homes that are being
11:06offered in this development, are still beyond the means of the average person in Swale. And
11:12admittedly, there are going to be some people on higher wages, but the majority of those 8400 houses
11:17will be bought by people who are selling up in south-east London, moving down to Swale. And I
11:23welcome some movement, but this level of movement is not sustainable, especially when it's on a
11:28development which is just going to be created where everyone has a job, where they need to
11:33drive to get to it. Tell you what, we're going to have to take a quick break now. We'll come back,
11:37we'll pick up this argument, we'll go back onto it, we'll talk a little bit about both sides of
11:40things. We'll be back in a few minutes' time. Don't go anywhere. We continue to talk about
11:45Highstead Park. 8400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
12:158400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
12:458400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
13:158400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
13:458400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
14:158400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
14:458400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
14:518400 homes, 12-week planning inquiry started this week. We'll be back in a few moments.
15:09Hello, welcome back to The Kent Politics Show live on KMTV. Well, we've been speaking
15:14about the planning inquiry earlier on in the programme. We will continue to do so.
15:198400 homes planned for the outskirts of Sittingbourne. It's proved incredibly controversial.
15:26Talking to Councillor Rich Layman from the Green Party, both sitting on KCC and Swellborough
15:32Council and also Richard O'Boyle, Chief Executive of the Pioneer Group who owns the Kent Science
15:37Park. Thank you both for hanging around. We'll keep talking about this. So, I'll come to you
15:42first, Richard. The proposal is that you would have a new motorway junction. How much, if that
15:48was to go ahead, would that transform the local area? I mean, for me, it's huge. I mean, it's not
15:53just obviously the access, but the fact it's privately funded, which often is missed. And if
16:03you look at the scheme itself, I mean, often sort of a big bugbear around for the people living
16:09in and around Sittingbourne and the hinterland around it is about traffic. And traffic can't
16:16be dismissed. And the fact that a lot of these houses in the community centres, the GP surgeries,
16:21the schools are designed and located with the latest thinking in terms of accessibility, where
16:27you're starting to give people a viable choice to jump on, not jump in the car, to jump on a bike,
16:35start walking. And that's the thing that I'm sort of most proud of, of the work that the
16:40developer and promoter has been doing. These proposals for a relief road have been around
16:45for a long time. I'm sure, Rich, you sit on a council council. I think they've been around
16:49since the early noughties, if not even longer. Science Park survived without it for 20 years.
16:57Why is it needed so much? Accessibility and the fact you now have to sort of access it through a
17:06single track road. I mean, it's sort of state of the obvious that if you're having access directly
17:09onto a motorway junction, you are therefore reducing the amount of diesel particulates,
17:17for example, in the air and so on and so forth. So it's actually, for me, it's something that will
17:24improve the sustainability of the Science Park in terms of environmental credentials.
17:28I mean, Rich, I don't think you would agree completely.
17:30No, no, I wouldn't.
17:31What would you say about this relief road at the new junction?
17:33I mean, initially, it's likely that there will be a reduction in traffic. But as these
17:39eight and a half thousand houses are built and occupied, you will have thousands of additional
17:44car journeys, which will initially return things to the current state and then take them beyond
17:51that. And then another road will need to be built and another however many thousand houses
17:56and the system goes on. We talk about growth, but in terms of economic growth, we've had
18:02economic growth almost every quarter in the UK since 2008. But how many people actually feel
18:08the benefit of that growth? We don't feel the benefit of that growth. What we need is
18:12sustainable growth. And I don't believe that this development offers that.
18:16So how do we find a solution then? Because if I was a business, an industrial business,
18:20you've got the Eurolink estate at the other end of town. Traffic is an absolute nightmare
18:28in Sitting Bull. And I've gone for a rush hour, particularly on the new link to the M2 and the
18:32other side of the town. It can be a standstill most evenings, even though there's new infrastructure
18:36for national highways in place. It's not that attractive to businesses, is it, at the moment,
18:41the town? What do you do? That's a very good question. I mean, it's very difficult to say
18:44what to do. But the reason partly that this has happened is because more and more houses
18:49have been built on the eastern side of Sitting Bull without the relevant infrastructure.
18:53But as I just said, if you build a road and accompany that road with thousands more houses,
18:59it's just returning yourself to square one. You'll see a temporary improvement
19:03and then a contraction of space on the road. It's crazy, I guess, that if you look at the
19:07Northern Relief Road, it currently ends in a cul-de-sac for me. And you've got sort of that
19:13significant public money in terms of infrastructure with HS1 you can start to leverage. That's where
19:19I started. I wrote back the clock 10 years ago when I started looking at the scheme and getting
19:25involved. It, for me, just applied common sense. It's not perfect. Don't get me wrong. I'm not
19:31trying to sort of ignore the negatives, but it's on balance. That's where I view it will be of
19:38benefit to the majority of the community and the businesses around. The part of this relief road
19:44would go for a section of ancient woodland. There are fears that it would not be able to bounce
19:50back. You need to have the habitats, ecosystems in the area where it cuts through the ancient
19:55woodland. That's going to be gone for good. It's an ancient woodland. You can't return it.
19:58Is it worth it, taking a relief road which will transport all this economic growth
20:03to destroy a part of an ancient woodland? I mean, obviously, it's not ideal. I mean,
20:10losing some of our ancient woodland. But again, it comes back to the pros and cons. For me,
20:17the fact that the pros in terms of accessibility, the amount of public space you're creating,
20:21the design in terms of that garden community where you're trying to influence people to
20:27have a viable choice not using the car has got to be of consideration in terms of those benefits.
20:35Rich, what would you say about that? It's going for an ancient woodland here,
20:38but there is a country park. More than 50% of the area would be publicly accessible.
20:43And actually, I think for a lot of people walking around a farmer's field, I mean,
20:47if you don't have the best mobility in the world, actually, you can't really, for starters,
20:52you can't just walk for any country farmer's field, but public footpaths aren't the most
20:57accessible all the time. Country park, I would imagine, Quinn would design it to be accessible
21:01for most people. Surely that's a good thing. You would think, wouldn't you? Ironically,
21:06I was just mentioning the houses built to the eastern side of Sittingbourne. One of those is
21:10Spring Acres just in Batchild. And that came with a country park, which this development is
21:16going to stick a massive road through. So you may say that the development includes a country park,
21:21but it's also putting a road through another one. It's just the ancient woodland, the loss of
21:27high grade, best and most versatile agricultural land. I mean, it's not very widely known just how
21:32little of that there is in the country. We're lucky to have a lot of it in Swale.
21:36And it's even less known how little of it is going to be not susceptible to flooding in the next few
21:43decades. So we need to really be protecting that best and most versatile agricultural land. And
21:48this development will do away with hundreds of hectares of it. Well, Quinn Estates, who are
21:53behind this development, aren't on the sofa, but they did send us a statement. They say,
21:57what we can say is that our proposal should be seen in a round that the development will
22:01sustainably answer local housing need for the long term, whilst also delivering significant
22:06environmental and economic benefits. They talk about the 50% of the land would be retained as
22:12publicly available open space and on affordable homes, they say is higher than the 4% that
22:17campaigners have been talking about. And they also talk about the economic potential, which we've
22:21been talking about in a lot of detail. At the top of their statement, though, they say it would not
22:24be appropriate for Quinn Estates to comment at this time on the process or the potential outcome
22:28of the inquiry that is now underway. Now, this inquiry last, it was last October, November,
22:33when it was called in two hours, 50 minutes before the planning committee, we're gonna,
22:37we're set to refuse it. Was that the right thing to do? Do you think, Richard, do you think the
22:43government should have stepped in on this one? I mean, I'm not an elected official. So I can't,
22:47you know, it's difficult for me to opine on the merits and argue for or against. But I have to
22:54say sort of as a, from a practical common sense perspective, the, you know, this is the system we
23:00have in place at the moment. So we have adopted that due process as a consortium, as a group.
23:07In some respects, this harks back to 2012, with when, with the dissolution of the regional
23:14development agencies, which would have historically looked at the southeast or the area in question
23:21and considered all things like where should development occur or not, as the case may be,
23:26where should houses, where should schools, where should GP surgeries and so on be located.
23:32It does seem that the local government has started moving back into that, into that sort
23:40of way of thought and that direction. But time will tell. Rich, do you think it was the right
23:46decision for the government to call it? It would have happened anyway. It would have been refused.
23:49Quinn would have likely... It would have gone to appeal. That's not quite the same.
23:53I, you know, it's, it's the timing, which is almost the most egregious thing around this,
24:01because, you know, Swell's planning officers had spent many years, thousands and thousands,
24:08probably tens of thousands of hours assessing every part of this and waiting for information
24:13to come back. I mean, I spoke to KCC Highways earlier today, and just in the last couple of
24:17weeks, the applicants have been submitting new information, which has been missing since 2021.
24:25So it's just bizarre that that's happened in that kind of timeline. And it's just,
24:32my fear is that the government's devolution plans, which are going to install mayors,
24:36will mean that more decisions are taken at a higher level, not taken by those who know the
24:41area that they're making the decision on, who understand the culture and the heritage of that
24:46area. And it will be easier to just steamroll local democracy and have decisions taken by mayors,
24:52or if the government's white paper is to be believed, that if the mayors aren't putting
24:56enough houses down, the government will do it for them. Richard, devolution on cards. I know
25:01you're not an elected official, but I'm sure you're aware that devolution plans are coming
25:05in at some point. I know for Kent, we're not 100% certain when that now will happen.
25:10Although local government reorganisation, as I'm sure Rich will be aware, because I know
25:14councils are all talking about it next week, we will all be under unitary soon,
25:19might simplify planning. Do you think unitaries could be a better thing? You're talking about
25:23local development councils. Do you think it could be a better thing for Kent?
25:26My personal view is, I hear the concerns from my colleague here on the sofa, but for me,
25:34it will be a better solution, because as a country, we need to consider where we will accept
25:41growth or not, as the case may be. And that's something that's difficult for locals to decide,
25:47and someone at a higher up level, maybe not quite at the top, can make that sort of balanced view
25:52where are the locations that it's best considered going forward. Right, we've only got a minute
25:57left, so in 20 seconds, last case for Hysted or not Hysted. I'll go to you, Rich, first.
26:03Hysted, last final thoughts. I mean, it's just, it's unaffordable,
26:07it's unsustainable, there's issues around water supply, food security, and
26:15I'm going to be a bit cheeky and say that the reason you struggled to find a politician who
26:19could come on and say, speak in favour of it tonight is because I think Kevin McKenna might
26:23be the only one. Richard. It will deliver the complete opposite of my learned colleague.
26:31In my view, it is a balanced proposition proposal that delivers growth in a sustainable
26:37manner that is affordable. It is delivering privately funded infrastructure that will be
26:43a game changer for the city-born residents. There we go. Lots of arguments. 11 weeks of this.
26:49That's all for tonight. We'll see you again soon.