空き家問題2025～進む人口減少と空き家対策の最前線～ #3 2025年3月9日
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00:00Do you know how many open houses there are in Japan?
00:10The number of open houses in Japan is 9 million.
00:15This is 13.8% of the total number of houses in Japan.
00:20If the number of open houses continues to increase,
00:25one out of every four houses in Japan will be open in 20 years.
00:33The background to this is population decline,
00:37aging society, and inheritance problems.
00:42The third episode of Akiya問題 2025.
00:50It used to be called Hakusanso.
00:53And now it's an open house.
00:58A hot spring resort that was once popular is now an open house?
01:03It's like a disinfecting machine.
01:06You can't even wash your hands.
01:09Complicated circumstances are intertwined,
01:13and even if you try to sell it, it won't sell.
01:16We approach the reality of open houses.
01:20If there are people in need, I'd like them to use it.
01:25To be honest, I don't know what to do.
01:32Akiya問題 2025.
01:35The battle between population decline and Akiya.
01:41The battle between population decline and Akiya.
01:45The third episode of Akiya問題 2025.
01:50We have Tomoyuki Maruoka,
01:53the CEO of NextVideo,
01:56who will talk about Akiya.
01:59And we have Ryoko Hirose.
02:02Nice to meet you.
02:05Have you ever heard of this word?
02:09Please take a look.
02:12Shakuchi and Sokochi.
02:15Sokochi?
02:18You've heard of shakuchi, right?
02:21I've heard of it.
02:24I feel like I'm reading it differently.
02:27It's an industry term, right?
02:29I don't think it's a commonly used term.
02:34Sokochi is a term used by landlords.
02:43It's a term used by landlords.
02:49Sokochi.
02:51And the other one is shakuchi.
02:55Have you heard of it?
02:56Yes, I have.
02:58It's a term used by landlords to rent land
03:03and use it as a building.
03:09If a landlord rents a land,
03:12there is a real estate agent who builds the building.
03:16Yes, there are many real estate agents like this.
03:20This time, we went to a real estate agency
03:25that deals with the issue of shakuchi and sokochi.
03:32It takes about 30 minutes by car from Mito Interchange,
03:36which is in the center of Ibaraki Prefecture.
03:39It's a town called Shirosato.
03:43While walking on a mountain road full of nature,
03:47I came across a shop.
03:50This used to be called Hakusanso.
03:54And now it's an open-air shop.
04:00This shop stands on a quiet mountain road.
04:04It's an open-air shop with a certain problem.
04:09It used to be a hot spring inn called Hakusanso,
04:13which was founded in the 21st century.
04:15It was an inn that attracted many people
04:18mainly because it was a simple fishing inn.
04:22But in 2021,
04:25the owner passed away and the shop was closed.
04:30It has been an open-air shop for about three years now.
04:36Until two and a half years ago,
04:39we were a local association in Shirosato.
04:42We were guided by Mr. Sakamoto,
04:46who was active as a local association in Shirosato until 2022.
04:53At that time, saunas and glamping were popular,
04:57so we wondered if we could reuse this property,
05:01and we found out that it was an open-air real estate.
05:05This time, we got permission to show you the inside.
05:27The inside of the building was left as it was at that time.
05:34If it's clean, it looks good.
05:37But it's quite damaged.
05:42This is the bathroom that was the most popular.
05:48It's a little rotten, so please be careful.
05:56This is the bathroom.
05:59It's a very serious bath.
06:01Yes, it's a wooden bath.
06:07When I hear the name Hakusanso,
06:10I think there are many people in the area who talk about this.
06:17Not only in the area, but from all over the country,
06:21there are many politicians who come here.
06:26I really wanted to come here when I was doing it.
06:29I heard it was a place where many people knew.
06:34Let's go further inside.
06:37This was originally a kitchen.
06:44It was probably used to cook local vegetables,
06:48pine nuts, and shiitake mushrooms.
06:54I think they probably shook their arms here.
06:57It's been a few months since it was abandoned.
07:02Yes, it's been left as it is.
07:07I feel like it's been left as it is since my mother passed away.
07:12The next place he showed us was...
07:16This is the room where I think Sakuma was.
07:21There are probably several rooms like this.
07:23I think he was sleeping in a bed like this.
07:28When I came here a few years ago,
07:31it wasn't that bad,
07:34but now it's like it's outside.
07:37The soil has fallen from the ceiling.
07:41I feel like it's been like that for the past year or two.
07:48It was only three years ago that this white sanso became an empty room.
07:54Tear-apart wallpapers and collapsed ceilings
07:58tell of the rapid decline of an empty room.
08:04Then, why has the condition of this room continued?
08:12My mother was doing it alone, but she passed away.
08:17After that, there was no one to support her.
08:22Her daughter took over the business,
08:25but she couldn't take over the business,
08:28so she abandoned the business.
08:32She couldn't even take care of the building.
08:36That's why it's been left as it is.
08:39In fact, this white sanso
08:42is the property of the owner of the land and the building.
08:46The owner of the land and the building
08:50passed away,
08:53and her family abandoned her, including the land.
08:57The ownership of the building
09:00has been left as it is.
09:03Even though she's the owner,
09:06she doesn't have the ownership of the building,
09:09so she can't sell it or take it.
09:12She's in trouble.
09:15I understand how difficult it is
09:18for her to live there alone.
09:23I wish I could talk to her
09:26about what I should do after this.
09:32I used to have a job,
09:36but I was busy at that time,
09:39so I couldn't go there.
09:42To be honest,
09:45I can't do anything about it.
09:48But if there's someone
09:51who needs my help,
09:54I'd like them to use it.
10:01How can we solve this problem?
10:06This time, we interviewed
10:09a hot spring resort in Ibaraki.
10:12It's a nice resort, isn't it?
10:15Yes, it has a good environment
10:18and the air is fresh.
10:21It's a shame.
10:23It's been three years.
10:26It's been three years.
10:29It's a shame.
10:32It's a shame.
10:35It's a shame.
10:38It's a shame.
10:40Now, let's look at the causes.
10:43The landowner of the residential building
10:46was Nagayama,
10:48who enacted a VTR.
10:51The owner of the building was Okami,
10:54the king's wife.
10:56Well, in 2021,
10:59the king's daughter abandoned thebuilding,
11:03and people in Ibaraki
11:06don't own a part of the building anymore.
11:08So, this doesn't belong to Jinushi-san?
11:12That's right.
11:14Jinushi-san was just renting the land to a landowner.
11:21And this building is owned by the landowner's wife.
11:27And this time, the child abandoned the inheritance.
11:33So, it's floating in the air.
11:36Hirose-san, it was impressive that you couldn't do anything about it.
11:41That's right.
11:43At that time, I really didn't have time or I couldn't do it.
11:49After all, there are many situations where you can't notice unless you try.
11:56The owner of the building is gone.
12:00And Jinushi-san is in trouble.
12:03Hirose-san, I'd like to ask you to do something about it.
12:08But I'm sure Mr. Nagayama is thinking,
12:12Even if I get the right to inherit the land,
12:16Should I put my hand on it and spend money on it and start over again?
12:21Or should I leave it as it is?
12:25I wonder if it will be negative.
12:28If you dismantle it one by one, will it cost money?
12:33That's right.
12:35To dismantle it, you have to put in a shovel or a heavy machine.
12:42If you go to the white coral part earlier,
12:45It's at the foot of the mountain, and the road is quite narrow.
12:50So, if you can't get in there with a heavy machine,
12:55It's going to cost a lot of money.
12:58Like removing asbestos.
13:00That's right. In the old days, asbestos was used to dismantle.
13:06It takes a lot of time and effort to dismantle it.
13:12Isn't there a subsidy for the local government?
13:15Yes, there is.
13:17It's a problem to leave the open space as it is.
13:22There is a subsidy system.
13:24If you want to dismantle it,
13:27I think it's a good idea to consult with the local government about the subsidy.
13:31What kind of solution is there in this case?
13:34I will explain it to the lawyer after this.
13:37I think there are a lot of people who take over the production of asbestos
13:41by inquiring from businessmen.
13:43I think there are a lot of people who take over the production of asbestos
13:46without paying for it.
13:49Today, we are going to talk about the problem of asbestos on the ground and on the ground.
13:56I asked the lawyer what kind of solution there is
14:00when a building that was abandoned on the ground is left behind.
14:05An object like asbestos that has become an open space
14:09without the owner of the building.
14:14I asked Mr. Okada, a lawyer,
14:18how to solve the problem of asbestos.
14:22From the perspective of the owner of the asbestos,
14:25it is a problem that the building of asbestos
14:28has no owner.
14:30By inquiring from businessmen,
14:33we will take over the production of asbestos
14:36and have the building demolished.
14:40An asbestos owner is a person who manages and produces asbestos
14:46when there is no owner or when all the owners give up their asbestos.
14:54In general, it is said that most lawyers are appointed.
15:00In this case, Mr. Nagayama, who is an outsider,
15:05filed a lawsuit in the Family Court,
15:08and the court sentenced the asbestos owner.
15:12The chosen asbestos owner will be able to buy and destroy the building
15:18with the permission of the court.
15:24I don't think the building of asbestos is worth 0 yen as an asset.
15:31There are people who want to buy a building with asbestos.
15:38The asbestos owner will sell the building to them
15:44and use the money to buy the building.
15:47By doing so,
15:49as an owner,
15:52a new owner will be clear,
15:56and the asbestos owner can claim the property.
16:00That's how it works.
16:02However, the process is not very smooth.
16:07It's not an easy process.
16:10In addition to the hurdles of the process,
16:13there are many people who give up claiming the property.
16:20In general, the most common case is that
16:23the asbestos owner has to pay for the claim.
16:29There are many people who give up claiming the property
16:33without paying for the claim.
16:36If the asbestos owner has a good property,
16:39it's easy to get rid of the asbestos owner.
16:42However, there are many cases where the asbestos owner
16:45has to pay for the claim.
16:47For example, if the asbestos owner has a land
16:50where no one needs it,
16:52and the asbestos owner has to pay for the claim,
16:55and the land and the property are getting old,
16:58the asbestos owner has to pay a lot of money.
17:02If the land and the property are combined,
17:05the property will be in deficit.
17:07If the asbestos owner pays the land,
17:09the property will be worth more than the land.
17:11There are many cases like this.
17:14The asbestos owner is a lawyer
17:18who was hired by a lawsuit.
17:20Therefore, the asbestos owner has to pay a lot of money
17:23If you don't, you won't be able to get a job.
17:26So, the cost of dealing with these problems,
17:30and basically, the compensation for the creators of these assets,
17:35these are the things that the plaintiffs have to pay to the court.
17:41There are many people who can't pay for these things.
17:44So, in this case like the Hakusan case,
17:48was there a way to live without becoming an empty house?
17:53If I were to die, I would have to transfer this building to the owner.
18:02That's what I would have to say.
18:05By doing that, the owner wouldn't be able to keep this building.
18:12So, as a lawyer, I wouldn't want to leave a building that no one else owns on my property.
18:22There might be a way to do that.
18:24I think it would be best to think about what would happen to this building
18:30if the owner of the property died.
18:36So, we've heard the lawyer's story.
18:39What do you think, Hirose-san?
18:42There are so many things I don't know, so I really have to study.
18:47Or maybe I should change the law.
18:49Change the rules?
18:51Something like that.
18:54I was envious of you, Jinushi-san,
18:58but sometimes you get in a pretty tough position.
19:01That's true.
19:02I think a lot of people don't understand that you can't do anything if you're in this position.
19:11And when you're moving out,
19:14there are things you don't know, like,
19:17your father used to rent this land.
19:19And on the other hand,
19:21there are a lot of cases where you don't know that this land used to be your home.
19:28I think you have to start by understanding that.
19:32That's right.
19:33It's important to have an open mind.
19:35Yes, it is.
19:37Let's write it down.
19:39It's important to discuss in advance
19:42what kind of case we should do,
19:44and what kind of pattern we should do.
19:46It's important to discuss in advance.
19:48Yes, it is.
19:49It's very important to discuss in advance with everyone.
19:53What about your family, Hirose-san?
19:57It's not that specific,
20:00but when I was recording the first and second episodes,
20:06I thought there were a lot of unclear things.
20:09For example, if you look at the land and the building,
20:13you might think,
20:15who is this person?
20:17Or you might think,
20:19who is this person?
20:21Or you might think,
20:23so we need to think about all these things together.
20:28Yes, I'm sure there are a lot of viewers who are thinking about this.
20:32I'd like to show you another example based on the actual coverage.
20:38This is a story that happened in Tokyo.
20:40In the suburbs of Tokyo,
20:42in the 70s,
20:44it was a very old house and property.
20:47Matsuda-san was the one who inherited the land that his deceased parents lived in.
20:54He inherited it from his parents.
20:57However, he lived alone in Ibaraki,
21:01so he wanted to leave his family home.
21:03He was in Ibaraki, so it was a little far away,
21:05so he wanted to leave his family home.
21:08So he went to a competition with his father-in-law.
21:13His father-in-law bought the land including the building.
21:17He was relieved to hear that his father-in-law would buy the land and the building.
21:24However, his father-in-law suddenly changed his attitude.
21:28One day, his father-in-law went to the lawyer and said,
21:30I won't buy the building.
21:32Please return the land after you buy it.
21:35If you don't like it, please keep paying the land tax.
21:39That's what his father-in-law said.
21:41It must have cost a lot of money to dismantle the house.
21:45That's right.
21:46The building was old and wide,
21:49so it must have cost a lot of money to dismantle the house.
21:54There was a situation where his father-in-law's attitude changed.
21:58He probably didn't know.
22:00He thought he would get the land,
22:03but he didn't hear that it would cost a lot of money to dismantle the house.
22:06He thought it would be strange for his father-in-law to accept it.
22:10That's right.
22:12Both of them are not real estate professionals,
22:17so they didn't get along well.
22:26Mr. Matsuda, who understood the seriousness of the Akiya issue,
22:30continued to pay the heating bills of his uninhabited family.
22:34He also took care of the business.
22:36He said he had been paying the land tax for about a year and a half.
22:41So how should we solve this case?
22:47Basically, the land that Mr. Matsuda owned
22:53can actually be sold as it is.
22:57Is that so?
22:58Yes.
22:59Basically, you need permission from the owner.
23:03You need permission to sell it.
23:06However, unless there is a legitimate reason,
23:09you cannot refuse to sell it.
23:14Is that so?
23:15So he didn't know that he could sell it.
23:22So, by hiring real estate professionals,
23:27he was able to solve the problem.
23:31Mr. Matsuda decided to buy land from a real estate company.
23:38Based on the lesson learned from this issue,
23:41he learned that if there is a house that he doesn't plan to live in,
23:44he should either sell it to his parents or demolish it.
23:50The biggest reason to argue is when the land price changes.
23:56That's the biggest reason to argue.
23:59So, it's important to negotiate with the current price.
24:04As Mr. Hirose said,
24:06the keyword is to manage your property well.
24:10That's right.
24:13In recent years,
24:14after selling the property,
24:16there is a general method called leaseback.
24:23If you have a real estate company that you don't plan to live in the next generation,
24:27please consider these measures.
24:31So far, we have seen the case of sharing real estate.
24:34We have seen the case of sharing real estate.
24:37There were other cases of sharing real estate.
24:39This time, Mr. Murakami decided to buy a house from an old lady who had no children.
24:44However, there was a reason why the house didn't sell.
24:47Actually,
24:49this house didn't sell.
24:52Mr. Hirose, do you know what it is?
24:55I've only seen this house.
24:58Are these three houses the same?
25:01No.
25:03The answer is after the announcement.
25:05Don't pull me.
25:10This is a case of sharing real estate.
25:14Mr. Murakami tried to buy a house,
25:17but he couldn't because there was no sign.
25:23Mr. Hirose said he had seen this house.
25:27The answer is here.
25:30Because there was no sign.
25:33Are these three houses the same?
25:36Yes.
25:38I've only seen the left side.
25:41If this house didn't sell, it wouldn't have happened.
25:46However, if the buyer doesn't have a sign,
25:50the buyer can't tell the difference between a rent and a house.
25:54Then, the buyer may argue with the buyer.
25:57So, the buyer doesn't want to buy.
26:00In the past, there were houses that didn't have a sign.
26:05Some houses were scraped and hard to see.
26:10Some houses had a sign.
26:13Some houses were hard to find.
26:16Some houses were buried in the grass.
26:19In the countryside,
26:22it's hard to find a house in the forest.
26:27It's hard to find a house in the mountains.
26:30It's hard work.
26:32As Mr. Hirose said, it's hard to find a house in the forest.
26:37It's hard to find a house in the mountains.
26:40It's hard to find a house in the mountains.
26:44Is there a specialist who can help you?
26:48Yes.
26:49If there is no church,
26:51we can restore the house.
26:54There is a specialist called a land house investigator.
27:00If you ask the land house investigator,
27:03you can check the house.
27:05It's important to check the house.
27:08It's important to check the house.
27:11Yes, it's very important.
27:13We talked about various problems in Akihabara.
27:17Mr. Hirose, how was it?
27:21There were so many things I didn't know.
27:29It's the same for my family and me.
27:32Even if it's not now,
27:35if something happens,
27:38if someone falls,
27:40if it happens at that time,
27:42it will be gone.
27:44It's important to talk to each other
27:47and get to know each other.
27:51Is there any Akihabara measure we can take?
27:54It's important to check the house.
27:58It's important to check if there is a church.
28:03When you go home,
28:05it's important to talk to each other.
28:08Mr. Hirose, when you are in trouble,
28:11you realize that there is a real estate agency you can consult.
28:14Yes, that's right.
28:16I don't know where to consult.
28:19I don't even know who has the right to decide.
28:25I'm glad I found out this time.
28:27When this series continues,
28:30I'm looking forward to hearing what Mr. Hirose said.
28:34I'm looking forward to it.
28:36I'm looking forward to hearing what Mr. Hirose said.
28:41Mr. Hirose is fighting a lot.
28:44What should I do?
28:46I learned a lot from this.
28:48Everyone in front of the TV,
28:50please talk to your family
28:52so that you don't lose your wisdom.
28:55That's all for this week.