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00:00This is apropos. Well, since returning to office, Donald Trump and his administration
00:06have taken a number of actions aimed at restricting access to abortion, both within the U.S. and
00:12internationally, including pardoning anti-abortion protesters convicted of violating a law that
00:19protects abortion clinics and their patients, and freezing foreign aid, the U.S. being the
00:25single biggest donor to the United Nations Sexual and Reproductive Health Agency. Our
00:30New York correspondent Jessica LeMessurier reports on the case of one doctor who could
00:36face criminal prosecution for sending abortion pills out of state.
00:42A doctor here in New York has found herself at the center of a legal battle over women's
00:47reproductive rights in the United States. Dr. Margaret Carpenter is facing legal challenges
00:52in two states where abortion is almost entirely banned. A Texas judge has fined her over
00:57$100,000 for sending abortion pills to someone in the state. And in Louisiana, the attorney
01:02general has signed an extradition request for Dr. Carpenter after she was indicted for
01:07prescribing an abortion pill to a teenager there. Take a listen.
01:12She's not a provider. She's a drug dealer. She didn't provide care to anybody.
01:16While New York's Governor Kathy Hochul was quick to respond to that, she says she won't
01:20comply with the extradition request.
01:23When the attorney general of Louisiana calls this doctor a drug dealer, I want all Americans
01:30to know exactly what that means. As a result of the Trump administration stacking the Supreme
01:36Court, overturning Roe v. Wade, which gave us protections that we took for granted for
01:42almost 50 years, that now doctors who are trained to protect the lives of women and
01:47give them the options and choices that they have as a right are now being called drug
01:52dealers, this fight is going to continue.
01:55This appears to be the first time that a state has criminally charged a doctor in another
02:00state for prescribing abortion drugs. New York and several other Democratic-led states
02:06have passed so-called shield laws to protect doctors who provide abortion pills to patients
02:11in other states. This case is an early test of conservative states' power to prosecute
02:17doctors outside their borders and stop abortion medication from reaching their residents.
02:23The Abortion Coalition for Telemedicine, which was co-founded by Dr. Carpenter, says that
02:27threats against doctors jeopardize women's access to reproductive health care and should
02:32alarm everyone.
02:34Jessica LeMessurier reporting there from New York.
02:37Well, for more, we're joined now by Julie FK, co-founder of the Abortion Coalition for
02:41Telemedicine. Thank you so much for being with us this evening, Julie, on the programme
02:46here. As I say, you co-founded the organisation that Dr. Carpenter represents. How did you
02:51find yourselves at the centre of this firestorm?
02:55Well, the Abortion Coalition for Telemedicine, or ACT, is the only national reproductive
03:03rights organisation that stands up for telemedicine from licensed practitioners in all 50 states.
03:09So we were built and designed to protect access to telemedicine for all patients, no matter
03:15what zip code or their ability to pay.
03:19And talk to us a little bit more about Dr. Carpenter. Does she risk arrest, essentially,
03:24if she travels out of state? What is the current situation for the doctor?
03:31You know, abortion providers in America are a unique bunch of physicians who are really
03:38mission driven. They recognise that reproductive health care is essential, and so they are
03:42dedicated to making sure that women and pregnant people get access to that.
03:47The SHIELD laws create a safe way for licensed practitioners to give certified medications
03:54to patients anywhere and will not turn them over to anti-abortion politicians who bring
04:00lawsuits. So right now, Dr. Carpenter has had the strong support of Governor Hochul
04:06in New York State, and we expect that other governors will similarly stand up for Dr.
04:11Carpenter's right to perform safe, legal and licensed care without risk of criminalisation.
04:18And Julie, what wider consequences could this case have, and do you expect that there will
04:23be others?
04:28We would not be surprised to see increased attacks on access to Mifepristone, which is
04:33the key medication that is used for safe abortion care globally. We expect that the anti-abortion
04:41forces who have for decades been trying to reduce women's access to abortion and to medication
04:47abortion will continue that. And when you go after a doctor, whether it's Dr. Carpenter
04:52or one of the many, many other doctors who are providing safe access to telemedicine
04:57abortion, you're really undermining the ability of tens of thousands of women to get access
05:02to safe care and to make the decisions that they need that are best for their families.
05:08And right now in the United States, one fifth of all abortions are done by telemedicine,
05:13and it's the fastest growing method of abortion in the United States. So it has really brought
05:18the attention of anti-abortion officials who want to make abortion unavailable nationwide
05:25in the United States.
05:26And you and your organisation, you're determined not to back down on this. What happens next
05:31for you?
05:33Well, what happens next in these cases depends on whether these state officials continue
05:41these cases. Seventy percent of Americans want access to abortion under the Roe framework
05:48that was taken away by the Supreme Court. So, you know, there may be a kind of stranglehood
05:53on the legal enforcement in these states, but it doesn't represent popular opinion.
06:00And we're going to keep fighting for the rights of women to make decisions about whether when
06:04and whom and with whom to have children or not as a fundamental human right and as one
06:09that many, many states are standing behind for everybody throughout the nation.
06:14Donald Trump, he's moved separately to drop a high profile case, this one in Idaho. It's
06:19a long running legal battle over the right to emergency abortion services there. So what
06:24kind of signal does this send about how Donald Trump plans to interpret federal law going
06:29forward, laws that are designed essentially to protect urgent care when they come up against
06:36individual states, individual abortion bans?
06:44What we've seen through the Trump administration's dropping of a lawsuit out of Idaho, as well
06:50as other state and federal actions towards removing lifesaving medical care for miscarriage
06:56management, for post abortion care, for pregnancy complications, is that they are devaluing
07:01women's lives. They are really playing Russian roulette with anybody who goes into a hospital
07:07seeking unbiased and best quality medical care to deal with pregnancy complications,
07:13with miscarriage or a whole range of conditions. And it's really appalling to see that they
07:19would start trying to take away the right to somebody's life and health and future fertility
07:24simply because of an anti-abortion agenda.
07:27Yeah. And speaking of that agenda, as you see it, Donald Trump is so far avoided questions
07:32about whether he'd veto a national ban on abortion. Are you concerned that that is actually
07:37where the U.S. is moving?
07:43This is the president that brought us an ultra conservative Supreme Court that had one goal
07:48and that was to overturn Roe versus Wade, and they've done that. And they took away
07:52a lot of constitutional rights in doing that, rights that have been established for 50 years
07:57and rights to abortion care that were also very similar to the rights of LGBTQ people
08:03to have marriage, of interracial marriage. So he has really taken a big whack at our
08:09constitutional rights. And I don't trust that that won't happen again. Unless we really
08:14start standing up and protecting our reproductive freedoms, the right to access contraception,
08:21IVF, emergency contraception, abortion and safe maternal care for everybody, then we're
08:27going to lose those rights. It's really important that Americans really keep their eye on the
08:33goal of expanding and restoring abortion rights in this country for everyone.
08:38And Julie, those rights, they obviously differ depending on which state you're in. Vastly,
08:44you mentioned those shield laws earlier. New York is one of the Democrat led states that
08:48has specific legislation protecting doctors who provide abortion pills to women in other
08:54states. But how does that actually work in practice, legally speaking? How is that protection
08:59offered to them?
09:03So eight states have passed telemedicine abortion shield laws. Some are led by Democratic governors.
09:09Some are led by Republican governors. And it really is a step forward to say that if
09:14a licensed practitioner is using telemedicine within that state, within that shield state,
09:20that it doesn't matter where the patient is. The abortion is taking place within the state
09:25and they will protect that doctor's, that licensed practitioner's right to provide safe
09:30care regardless of the patient location. We talk about it as the modern day house call,
09:36that the doctor is treating patients regardless of where they are. And it really has been
09:42tremendously successful in serving women in areas that are under resourced because there
09:48just aren't clinics. But even in places, Boston, Chicago, major cities where women choose telemedicine
09:55because they can have the exact same medications, taking them in the safety and comfort of their
09:59own home without having to travel, without having the costs and expense and having to
10:04go past clinic harassers and others. So there are a lot of benefits and we want to make
10:09sure that every woman gets to make the decision about what method of abortion is right for
10:13her.
10:14And Donald Trump's decisions and his actions, they're not just having repercussions for
10:19women in the U.S. Talk to us a little bit about the impact that the decision to freeze
10:24foreign aid has had on reproductive health services around the world, particularly for
10:30the most vulnerable women.
10:35The denial of funding from the Trump administration has had devastating effects in many different
10:41parts of the world. Access to contraception is a key part of women's health. We already
10:47weren't funding much access to abortion services, but even medical trials, all sorts of pregnancy
10:54care, there are so many ways that reproductive health care needs support. And to all of a
11:00sudden cut off that support, we're really putting women's lives in danger. And I think
11:05the thing to remember is that when we look at how we provide care, even in the U.S.,
11:10we have one of the worst maternal mortality rates in the world and we have the ability
11:14to do much better. And we need to, we need to stop playing politics with women's lives.
11:18Julie, we'll have to leave it there for now. We do really appreciate you joining us on
11:23the programme this evening. That's Julie FK, co-founder of the Abortion Coalition for
11:27Telemedicine. Thank you so much for being with us. Well, that is it from us for now.